Upgrading to 1 1/4" Main Line

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Twowaxhack

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Again the table doesn't rely on all of the fixtures being used at once. Your saying that not the table.
The total is based on you adding up the units.,

The units are based on the fixtures.....

That won’t be all used at once or even close.,

If they’re not calculating them being used then why are they considered ?

The book is written by morons.
 

JG plumbing

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The more fixture units the less the fixture units rely on gpm. That's how it accounts for it. You don't understand it, that's why you don't get it.
 

JG plumbing

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As you get farther from the number one the relationship between fixture units and gpm gets farther apart. The curves diverge. I don't know why I keep explaining this to a plumber of 36 years.
 

JG plumbing

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I'm kind of done with this. I can't stay half way nice and keep explaining.
 

Twowaxhack

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Do what you want man. The industry will move on without you.
Hopefully so, and it’s moving toward less water not supplying 1.5” meters for a single family house in the burbs just because a guy wants some extra baths for convenience.
 

Twowaxhack

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The more fixture units the less the fixture units rely on gpm. That's how it accounts for it. You don't understand it, that's why you don't get it.
I don't understand it because it doesn’t make sense.

So the more fixtures a house has the less the fixture units rely on GPM.

Oh yeah.....that’s makes a lot of sense.

The more fixtures then the less gallons per minute matters. Gotcha 👍
 

Twowaxhack

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I'm kind of done with this. I can't stay half way nice and keep explaining.
You’re not explaining. You’re trying to parrot a book that was written by morons.

It’s called the plumbing code. That’s why there are several and they all differ and they often change. Because people don’t agree on how they arrive at their garbage they print.

Then you have the local amendments that limit and exclude stupid things like requiring 1.5” meters at a house because a guy has a few extra baths.

The book is telling you the meter should be 1.5” but the house couldn’t even come close to using the amount of water that meter will flow in the given situation.

A 1.5” (50 + gpm) meter would flow more than double the water of what a 1.25” pipe can carry.

That’s why you see water mains upsized but with a smaller meter, not the other way around.
 
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Twowaxhack

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The code book has developed a forumula that I do not agree with.

I’ve had much success in real world pipe sizing without using their flawed crap for a residential home.

Despite what some think, the code book is not a holy doctrine.
 

JG plumbing

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Ok man that's fine. I don't know why you're disagreeing has to be a thing. If you think 1"meter and 1.25" main works that's fine. I'm sure it'll work. The code had fudge factor built in for variables and what not. I'm sure he'd be fine. It's all fine. You can say you disagree and I'm fine with that. I might not do it that way either. I just don't want to tell some guy he can do something and then have him come back here all pissed thinking "why did no one tell me this?". I try to be thorough. And I'm not always right.
 

Twowaxhack

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Ok man that's fine. I don't know why you're disagreeing has to be a thing. If you think 1"meter and 1.25" main works that's fine. I'm sure it'll work. The code had fudge factor built in for variables and what not. I'm sure he'd be fine. It's all fine. You can say you disagree and I'm fine with that. I might not do it that way either. I just don't want to tell some guy he can do something and then have him come back here all pissed thinking "why did no one tell me this?". I try to be thorough. And I'm not always right.
You remind me of myself years ago.
I would use the code to back my position up.
What I started finding out is that the code was full of crap on some things.

Their formulas don’t always hold true.

Their rules are often for special situations and perfect storms.

I’m not attacking you, I’m attacking the code and their formula.

I would be on jobs reciting code like Bible versus and would get laughed at. Because half the crap I was taking as fact was simply a few peoples opinion on the subject that wrote the code.
 

JG plumbing

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I have one of those plumbing manuals from the 40's. Johnsons handy manual. I like to read it and see all of the different things from different years.

I like the writer talking about how advanced and improved the copper pipe is. With the holes in the fittings for solder to flow into.

It all changes all the time based on different perspective.
 

Twowaxhack

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I have one of those plumbing manuals from the 40's. Johnsons handy manual. I like to read it and see all of the different things from different years.

I like the writer talking about how advanced and improved the copper pipe is. With the holes in the fittings for solder to flow into.

It all changes all the time based on different perspective.
We still have some of those old fittings with the holes still in service., the cups are like 1” deep. Good water here.
 

Twowaxhack

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If you see one take a picture I'd like to see. I keep hoping I'll find one.
Here’s an old one but it’s not as old as what we’re talking about. Made by “ standard “ I just went out and found it in my shop.
I’ll keep a look out, for the other fittings.,C85BCD78-4E54-49F4-BE03-8D9E6FB88B03.jpeg

You can see the MIP adapter is different.....
 

frodo

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right here right now, over there later on.
We would only use atmospheric backflow preventers screwed onto the hydrants if they’re above ground. Then break the set screw off so they can’t be easily removed.

If it’s a dedicated irrigation meter the water company provides the protection with the meter for us. Maybe that’s not common for other areas.
never seen that. typically. you are given 1 meter
after the meter you install a tee, one side goes to the house the other gets a double check on the iregation
everything upstream of the meter is the responsibility of the home owner. .
 

frodo

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septic tanks are sized figured on number of bedrooms.
the building code sets the number of persons per bedroom at 2
so using that logic a residential home with 4 persons / 2 bedrooms cn have a minimum tank size of 750 gallons
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FishScreener

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The first thing is: Will the water provider let you have large enough meter. And, what will the water rate be with the larger meter. Many systems are limiting the size they will connect to a residential service. Others have sliding fee schedules where if you install a large meter to a house, they charge you more per gallon base, and then it goes up exponentially as the usage per month goes up, first so many gallons at $X/gallon, then the next tier they charge 1.5 times as much, next tier goes up 1.5 times again, etc. Top tier can be ten times as much. When I worked in Vegas there was an older woman on a 2.5 acre residential estate, who had a 1-inch meter for her irrigation. The whole place was in turf. In winter she had it dethatched, and over seed with winter rye. It was always green.

She was paying over $1500/month for water, including in the winter. The folks in the water conservation office tried for two years, to get her to xeriscape, and she had no interest. Lots of money, and in her eighties. She knew she couldn’t take it with her, and the green grass made her happy.

But most of us aren’t in that financial position. So, check on what it might cost. And, you can’t just install a larger meter. You will need a new service lateral from the main. If you have to replace pavement, it can get really expensive, really fast.

And, you have to be careful about too large of a line. I have building at one of the ranger stations, where the Road Crew put in a new 3-inch line to their office. Back in the day when they had 8 full time people year round they could get enough circulation that it kept clean. No that the Forest has dropped from a road crew of 16 year round, to 2 year round employees, they cant use enough water to keep the water in the pipe fresh, and have to leave the water running, and make ice sculptures in the winter.

They never needed a 3-inch line, and now I’m probably going to have to install a new 1-inch. All Ihave to do is find the money.
 
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