Help needed with mystery leak

[edfiero]

I've been chasing this leak for at least a year now. Hopefully someone can help.
My powder room toilet leaks from under the toilet at the floor. What I know:
1. The supply line is NOT leaking.
2. The Tank is NOT leaking.
3. There is no CONDENSATION on the outside of the tank or bowl.
4. Liquid is from the bowl, not the tank as the floor smells of urine.

I have tried 3 or 4 different wax rings. thin ones, fat ones, ones with the 'funnel' attached.

Picture of current 'ring' attached.


I have silicone sealed the top of this flange to the bottom of the toilet. After it still leaked, I have removed the toilet to confirm that the silicone is holding and that there are no weak points between the top of the ring/flange and the bottom of the toilet.

I HAVE REPLACED THE ENTIRE TOILET because I thought sure there must be a crack in the old one.

I have installed an additional studor vent under the sink the powder room thinking that it was a vent issue.

There is no obvious flow restriction in the waste pipe as toilet flushes well and always eliminates all waste with a single flush.

Since the ring/flange ring thing is tightly sealed to the bottom of the toilet it seems that the leak could only be coming between the pvc pipe and this 'ring'. Is there a minimum vertical drop that is required before the waste line is elbowed? My elbow in the floor is attached directly to the toilet floor flange. Perhaps the discharge water is splashing back up from the elbow because there is not enough vertical distance ????? Seems like a long shot, but that is all I can think of.

I have looked at the pipes from underneath in the basement, there is no EXTERNAL leak. Floor flange is screwed to the subfloor, so it is sturdy, and it's glued to the elbow.

The more the toilet is flushed the more the leak. If there is no flushing, I don't think it leaks.

Anyone want to take a crack a this one???

 

[havasu]

I'm gunna throw in my thought. With the overhead shot, I can't tell if there is a lip between the tile and the flange. If it is leaking at the base of the toilet, I would try an extra thick wax ring as my first fix. Also, do you have animals? If so, it is possible the strong urine smell is coming from animals thinking your toilet is a fire hydrant?

 

[frodo]

heres what you do.

use the "country boy leak detector"

place toilet paper around the toilet.

toilet paper will immediately show water, when wetness touch's it.

flush the toilet and look for wetness. it their is ! drop of water, it will show up.


how high is the water level in the bowl ?

 

[edfiero]

....With the overhead shot, I can't tell if there is a lip between the tile and the flange. If it is leaking at the base of the toilet, I would try an extra thick wax ring as my first fix. Also, do you have animals? If so, it is possible the strong urine smell is coming from animals thinking your toilet is a fire hydrant?

The floor flange is about 1/4 inch above the tile floor.
Already tried one of those thick wax rings. (Interesting thing is after each of my repair attempts, the floor is dry for a few days, even as long as 2 weeks before it gets wet again)

We do have some annoying cats that I have seen let loose outside of their box before, but that is typically a large quantity. The leak I have at the toilet is very small. Most of the time its just the grout in the tile getting wet. There are no 'puddles' on the floor.

 

[edfiero]

heres what you do.

use the "country boy leak detector"

place toilet paper around the toilet.

toilet paper will immediately show water, when wetness touch's it.

flush the toilet and look for wetness. it their is ! drop of water, it will show up.


how high is the water level in the bowl ?

Water is not high in the bowl. Similar to any other toilet in the house. Well under half full. Perhaps 1/4.

I'm going to try the country boy method, as well, as putting a rug on the floor in front of the toilet just to eliminate any chance that it is due to one of the cats (or my 4 year old kid). If the floor is still wet under the rug, then that will seal the deal that is coming from under the toilet.

 

[frodo]

is your four year old a boy?


he is your problem. most boys have figured out they can point and shoot that thing.

he might be chasing the cat or aiming at the soap.

my son peed on his sister. he got "in big trouble, mom did not think it funny"

 

[edfiero]

Ok guys. I've been monitoring for a week now. Wife put down one of her fu-fu rugs in front of the toilet, and I added some attractive toilet paper wrap so I could catch any gifts from the kid or the cats.

Paper is dry, floor is wet.

Floor leak is coming from under the toilet and not from a source outside the bowl.

 

[CT18]

Try using one of the green neoprene wax rings. I have used 5 of them so far on toilets that were leaking at the wax ring, no leaks yet. They can also be pulled and reset. Love em

 

[frodo]

next question.

what elevation is the top of the closet color in relation to the floor. below? above?

if the closet collar is sitting flush on the finish floor. your cool

if it is level or below. that is the problem..double up, or triple up on wax

before you pull toilet. dump a bottle food coloring in bowl,

when you pull the toilet, look for a crack that has food coloring in it

 

[phishfood]

ALSO, setting a toilet properly is not as easy as it might seem. If you use a wax seal, any movement of the bowl after the wax seal is compressed will compromise the seal between the bowl and the flange.