Short Cycling Pump & Pressure Tank Problems

[Wellwellwell]

Hi, all-

The booster pump that pressurizes my pressure tanks is short cycling.

This first happened a few weeks ago. I drained both tanks, filled them, drained them again, filled them & the short cycling issue was fixed.

Until this afternoon. I had to leave, so I turned the pump off, left it until I got home, when it was dark & chilly.

I spent about 30 minutes messing with things and figured out 2 things that I hope will get me started on troubleshooting this issue:
1. Tank 1 (on the left) is not draining. After opening the spigot & letting things drain until there is no flow, but the tank is still full. Or at least so heavy I cannot rock it. I'm guessing it has a ruptured membrane & needs to be replaced.

2. Tank 2 (on the right) is not filling with water. I set the pressure on this tank a few weeks ago when I first looked at this issue. At that time I added a few pounds of air (with the tank empty) to bring it to 47PSI (pressure switch comes on at 50PSI). But tonight I noticed that with the system pressurized, this tank is empty. I can rock it slightly after the booster pump pressurizes the system.

When I first looked at this a few weeks ago all I did was drain the tanks, add a little air & things started working normally again. I assumed I had some silt or other debris in my pressure switch & running all the water flushed it out.

Now I'm wondering if it's possible that some of the membrane from Tank 1 could be blocking Tank 2?

Is this possible? Or do ruptured membranes just split & otherwise stay in place?

I replaced the pressure switch 2 years ago, so I'd be surprised if that had failed.

The tanks, though, are almost 20 years old, so I wouldn't be surprised to have a failure there.

A few weeks ago I was able to drain Tank 1 by pressurizing the tank through the Schrader valve on top of the tank. Could that have shredded the membrane? I wasn't in a hurry to drain the tank & I gave it an occasional burst of air to help things along, although I think I had the air hose set to about 130 PSI.

I don't understand why Tank 2 isn't working, though.

Love to hear your .02!

Best,

Chris

 

[Valveman]

The bladders in those tanks have probably been bad for a long time. Yes, the bag can seal over the inlet/outlet hole and not let water out. But I think the tank you believe is not taking water actually is. If it was not taking water the pump would only run maybe 2 seconds. Tanks with good bladders feel empty, even after the pump has filled the tank. That is because at 50/70 pressure a 80 gallon tank only holds about 18-20 gallons of water, the rest is air. When a tank loses its air charge, it is usually from a bad bladder or diaphragm. Cycling on and off is what causes tank bladders to fail, as well as pumps, pressure switches, check valves, etc. A pressure switch might be toast in 2 days if the tanks are waterlogged.

 

[Wellwellwell]

The bladders in those tanks have probably been bad for a long time. Yes, the bag can seal over the inlet/outlet hole and not let water out. But I think the tank you believe is not taking water actually is. If it was not taking water the pump would only run maybe 2 seconds. Tanks with good bladders feel empty, even after the pump has filled the tank. That is because at 50/70 pressure a 80 gallon tank only holds about 18-20 gallons of water, the rest is air. When a tank loses its air charge, it is usually from a bad bladder or diaphragm. Cycling on and off is what causes tank bladders to fail, as well as pumps, pressure switches, check valves, etc. A pressure switch might be toast in 2 days if the tanks are waterlogged.

Thank you for your reply, and the video, Valveman. A Cycle Stop Valve is new to me.

The gentleman who performed the initial installation 20 years ago was a great guy. His design has held up very well for us. Sadly he's passed. His name was Al and I miss him, he was truly a good person.

What do you call someone who does this kind of work? Plumber? Well Plumber? Anyway, the person I've used since then is Lance. He's a good guy too, but the last time I talked to him he was having health issues and I suspect he's retired.

BUT, I know a THIRD good guy, Dan, who helped us out once by coming by, diagnosing a bad capacitor & installing a new one at no charge. He's already earned my business.

So I think I'll just hook up my Harbor Freight 1HP Shallow Well Pump for today (poor man's booster pump & pressure tank) and give Dan a call tomorrow.

I think I'll get another pressure control switch, too, just to have one. Can't hurt.

Is a CSV something I can pick up at Lowes? Or a plumbing supply store? Or would I need to order one on-line?

Best,

Chris

 

[Valveman]

I assumed that was a submersible pump from the picture?

No, you can't get a Cycle Stop Valve at any box store. It is a disruptive product that makes pumps last longer and use much smaller pressure tanks. Box stores and pretty much anybody who makes a living selling pumps will not mention a Cycle Stop Valve. You have to find out about the good stuff on your own. Lol!

https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick