Plumbing help needed.

[Jean862]

Hi Everyone,

I'm hoping someone can help me before I have to call a plumber. I just installed a new full bath in my basement and every time I run the water in the laundry area (which is also downstairs) the pipes of the new plumbing bang in the wall. It happens every time a faucet opens / close. The original plumbing that I tapped into was 3/4-inch copper. I'm using 1/2-inch copper for the bathroom.

In the bathroom, the banging also happens, when the toilet runs, the sink faucet opens and closes and also the shower faucet.

I'm not sure what I did wrong, since all pipes were secured to the studs prior to closing the walls. I've also installed arrestors on the washer machine lines and under the bathroom sink lines. The issue is still there.

I'm thinking of just re-routing the pipes and installing new plex pipes to resolve the issue.

Any help with this will be appreciated.

Thank you!

 

[MicEd69]

If this happens when you open the valves, then it isn't waster hammer. And you said, "when the toilet runs". I'm assuming the bang happens when the toilet is first flushed and not something that is more continuous.

I would guess you either did not support the 1/2" copper pipes well enough, or you secured them too well and/or in the wrong places and/or with the incorrect materials.

Need pictures to determine the source of the banging, which I understand is hard to do now that the walls are "closed". But unless the way you secured them is visible, it's only a guess. I would sure hate to replace new copper with PEX if it were me.

 

[Jean862]

If this happens when you open the valves, then it isn't waster hammer. And you said, "when the toilet runs". I'm assuming the bang happens when the toilet is first flushed and not something that is more continuous.

I would guess you either did not support the 1/2" copper pipes well enough, or you secured them too well and/or in the wrong places and/or with the incorrect materials.

Need pictures to determine the source of the banging, which I understand is hard to do now that the walls are "closed". But unless the way you secured them is visible, it's only a guess. I would sure hate to replace new copper with PEX if it were me.

 

[Jean862]

Hi,

Thank you so much for replying to my post. These are the pictures I took prior to closing the walls. I don't hear the banging anywhere near the toilet area. but I can hear it in the back of the shower line. Image "Line 2".

And yes, giving the life span of copper over pex, I would definitely hate having to remove the copper to install pex.

Do you think adjusting the water pressure on the pressure valve would help? Its a 3 story house, I did not want to start messing with the pressure valve which might drop the pressure on the 3rd floor.

 

[GReynolds929]

I don't see any pipe clamps or straps securing the piping, or any insulators in the stud holes. How did you secure the pipes?

 

[havasu]

Are hot water pipes expanding into the wood when heated? They look pretty close.

 

[Jean862]

I don't see any pipe clamps or straps securing the piping, or any insulators in the stud holes. How did you secure the pipes?

Hi, they are secured with 1/2 inch plastic clamps from home depot. the type that have two butterfly holes to screw in the pipes. Aside from them being secured, they are also wrapped with insulation since they are near the concrete. I'm thinking of cutting them out of the wall and re-route them on top of the dropped ceiling for better access. and then I can better secure them from there.

 

[Jean862]

Are hot water pipes expanding into the wood when heated? They look pretty close.

Hi, they are pretty close to each other and I never thought that was going to be an issue . They also have in the insulation cushion wrapped around them where they touched each other. I think if they were to start banging against each other, the foam would provide a cushion to prevent it.

 

[CT18]

Your pipes are not secured properly and you may also have a hammer issue. When you close a valve quickly do you hear a bang. When water is flowing do you hear banging. If banging when closing, i would say a hammer issue. If it banging when flowing then i would say support issue

 

[Jean862]

Your pipes are not secured properly and you may also have a hammer issue. When you close a valve quickly do you hear a bang. When water is flowing do you hear banging. If banging when closing, i would say a hammer issue. If it banging when flowing then i would say support issE

Hi,

The pipes bang as soon as a faucet it opened and closed. While water is running, No banging. If I close the faucet slowly - No banging. I drained all the lines and filled the system with air and turned the water back on. It worked without any noise for 30 min and started again.

Water arrestors were installed on the faucet lines but doesn't seem to resolve the issue.

A local plumber recommended that I install two pressure reducer as the pressure on the lines are too high.

I'm reaching out to the town now to let me know their inlet pressure so I can have an idea what I'm dealing with. I also ordered a pressure gauge to check the pressure inside of the house. if its too high, I will try to lower it before moving the pipes from the back of the wall.

most likely im going to end up removing the pipes from the back of the wall, re-routing them above the dropped ceiling - where I can play with them further as far as securing them further. (But the boss (My wife) wants me to dry lowering pressure before cutting into the wall more)

 

[CT18]

You can buy a gauge that can be screwed on a hose bibb or the laundry tub faucet yourself to check pressure. Should be no higher than 60PSI ideally. They sell them at hardware store or you can order one.

 

[havasu]

As I recommended on another forum, do not rely on the city to tell you what your incoming pressure is. Go out and buy a pressure gauge that screws onto your yard spigot. They can be found at any big box store for about $12, and you will know exactly what your pressures are.

 

[Jean862]

You can buy a gauge that can be screwed on a hose bibb or the laundry tub faucet yourself to check pressure. Should be no higher than 60PSI ideally. They sell them at hardware store or you can order one.

Thank you, and yes.
I have one coming today so I can check the pressure myself as well.

 

[TomFOhio]

Let us know what it is.

 

[Jean862]

Let us know what it is.

Hi Everyone,

I just had a chance to take the water pressure with a gauge. It's reading a little over or 70 psi.

 

[MicEd69]

That's pretty normal. Monitor the gauge and have someone open and close a faucet and see what the pressure does when you hear the "bangs".

Since the noise happens when the toilet is flushed, it obviously happens when cold water is used. Does it happen when only hot water is used in the sink? If it does, is the "bang" the same sound?

And in re-looking at your pictures, the pipes are running on the back side of the studs next to the concrete wall. You describe the clamps you used as "1/2 inch plastic clamps from home depot. the type that have two butterfly holes to screw in the pipes." Can you show a picture of them? I'm assuming they actually don't "screw in the pipes", LOL. And as you couldn't install them on the studs facing the concrete wall, I'm assuming they wrap around the pipe and are installed on the side of the stud.


I think you have a support problem.

 

[CT18]

Yeah something is loose somewhere and banging when there is a pressure change

 

[Jean862]

I'm going to try to see what happens when the water turns on and see how the gauge behaves.

 

[Jean862]

That's pretty normal. Monitor the gauge and have someone open and close a faucet and see what the pressure does when you hear the "bangs".

Since the noise happens when the toilet is flushed, it obviously happens when cold water is used. Does it happen when only hot water is used in the sink? If it does, is the "bang" the same sound?

And in re-looking at your pictures, the pipes are running on the back side of the studs next to the concrete wall. You describe the clamps you used as "1/2 inch plastic clamps from home depot. the type that have two butterfly holes to screw in the pipes." Can you show a picture of them? I'm assuming they actually don't "screw in the pipes", LOL. And as you couldn't install them on the studs facing the concrete wall, I'm assuming they wrap around the pipe and are installed on the side of the stud.
View attachment 44914

I think you have a support problem.

Hi, Yes these are the clamps. The studs are installed every 8-10 inches from each other. and 1 clam is installed on each studs- alternating from cold to hot water. I'm going to lower the pressure a little to 60 PSI and if it continues, I will simply re-route the pipes away from the back of the wall to above of the dropped ceiling. that way if it was an issue with them being secure, than I can ensure they are because they will not be visible/ Accessible.

 

[Jean862]

I just lowered the water pressure from what it was 70 psi to 45 psi. pipes are still banging. I'm getting tired of this. I'm just going to reroute the pipes from behind the wall.

Thank you so much everyone.