Inlet plumbing?

[sds1]

Can someone please advise what this threaded copper fitting on the inlet is connected to, and what I'd expect to find beyond?

I want to replace the dip tube. Every picture, diagram, video out there shows units with a nipple between the heater and cold water plumbing. I want to be prepared with right parts, tools on hand before I go cutting copper pipe.



Wide view of water heater plumbing for reference:

 

[GReynolds929]

It's a copper male threaded directly into the tank.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Why do you want to replace the diptube ?

How old is the heater ?

 

[sds1]

It's a copper male threaded directly into the tank.

Thanks, how is the dip tube attached?

 

[sds1]

Why do you want to replace the diptube ?

How old is the heater ?

Because I suspect it is broken. I've put new elements and thermostats, the water gets hot but is 20 degrees below thermostat setting and doesn't last as long as it should.

The heater was manufactured in 1997 which as I understand is from an era where they used a plastic dip tube that deteriorated easily.

 

[MicEd69]

27 years out of a water heater is pretty good. Maybe it's time for a new water heater???

 

[sds1]

27 years out of a water heater is pretty good. Maybe it's time for a new water heater???

Why buy a new unit if the old one can be reasonably repaired?

 

[Twowaxhack]

Easy test. Connect a water hose to the drain valve by using a washing machine hose connected to your garden hose that’s connected to a cold water hose Bibb. Turn both the drain valve on and the hose Bibb. Close the cold water inlet valve to the water heater.

Now you don’t need a dip tube and see if your heater puts out the correct temp and volume.

However, before you do that, simply turn off the cold water inlet to the water heater and go to a hot water faucet that’s not pressure balanced and open the faucet. The water should stop running after the pressure is relieved. If it doesn’t stop then you have a “ cross connection “ where cold is flowing into the hot side diluting temp/volume.

Easy test, as no pipes will be cut.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Also make sure you don’t have a hot water leak. if you have a water meter you can check it for movement indicating a leak. If it shows a leak, turn off cold inlet to water heater and see if it stops the leak. You must have a good stop valve at the water heater to do this.

 

[sds1]

@Twowaxhack thank you.

No water meter here (on a well) but I don't suspect any leaks...

But the other two tests you mentioned seem wise so I will give those a try. Can you tell me why you specified the washing machine hose? Why not connect the garden hose directly from heater drain to cold water spigot?

 

[Twowaxhack]

@Twowaxhack thank you.

No water meter here (on a well) but I don't suspect any leaks...

But the other two tests you mentioned seem wise so I will give those a try. Can you tell me why you specified the washing machine hose? Why not connect the garden hose directly from heater drain to cold water spigot?

The drain on the water heater has male garden hose threads and so does the end of your garden hose. So you need a jumper…..
WM hose has two female ends to act as a coupling.

 

[sds1]

The drain on the water heater has male garden hose threads and so does the end of your garden hose. So you need a jumper…..
WM hose has two female ends to act as a coupling.

Ahh right of course, for some reason I was thinking the garden hose was same fitting on both ends.

 

[sds1]

However, before you do that, simply turn off the cold water inlet to the water heater and go to a hot water faucet that’s not pressure balanced and open the faucet. The water should stop running after the pressure is relieved. If it doesn’t stop then you have a “ cross connection “ where cold is flowing into the hot side diluting temp/volume.

I did this test and the water stops flowing.

Can you help me understand better what this test demonstrates? I thought the internal tank was one big chamber so I don't understand the hot side/cold side or concept of a cross connection between the two sides.

 

[Twowaxhack]

I did this test and the water stops flowing.

Can you help me understand better what this test demonstrates? I thought the internal tank was one big chamber so I don't understand the hot side/cold side or concept of a cross connection between the two sides.

If the hot and cold water water piping are connected without a check valve then the hot could flow into the cold and the cold could flow into the hot. It would cause the same symptoms as a top fed water heater without a dip tube. The purpose of the dip tube is to convey cold water to the bottom portion of the tank to push the hot water out of the top.

So a crosss connection could be a hot and cold pipe connected together, a faucet with the hot and cold left on with the spout/outlet capped, a bottom fed return recirculating hot water pump that’s not running and there’s no Check valve. There are many examples of a cross connection.

I need a shot of whiskey.

 

[sds1]

Oooh OK so not really having anything to do with the water heater, you were exploring other possible explanations for diluted hot water. OK cool so we can cross that one off the list then.

FWIW you made me think to mention but the copper pipe at the water heater inlet is fairly warm. Seems relevant regarding a possible bad dip tube.

I need a shot of whiskey.

Are you saying I need to bribe you with alcohol for further assistance?

 

[Twowaxhack]

Oooh OK so not really having anything to do with the water heater, you were exploring other possible explanations for diluted hot water. OK cool so we can cross that one off the list then.

FWIW you made me think to mention but the copper pipe at the water heater inlet is fairly warm. Seems relevant regarding a possible bad dip tube.


Are you saying I need to bribe you with alcohol for further assistance?

The hot and cold piping at the top of the water heater is normal. Heat wants to migrate out of the tank, heat rises. The industry developed “ heat trap “ nipples that help keep that migration to a minimum because it cuts down on heat loss which translates into conserving energy. You don’t have heat traps.

I’m not above taking a shot or two, I could be easily talked into it. but no, I’ll help ya fo free.

 

[sds1]

You don’t have heat traps.

Well actually, my model # has the (T) designation which according to the parts list/diagram states that an inlet tube with heat trap is used on my unit:



Perhaps the heat trap is now sitting at the bottom of the tank?

 

[Twowaxhack]

Perhaps the plumber removed them and went straight into the tank with copper per your pic.

 

[Twowaxhack]

 

[sds1]

Perhaps the plumber removed them and went straight into the tank with copper per your pic.

Maybe. The parts list makes mention of nipples w/ heat trap, a different part than the "inlet w/ heat trap" I highlighted above. So I'm not sure what to make of that. Different kind of heat trap? Maybe on my unit it was a complete tube/nipple (w/ heat trap) assembly?

Notice though apparently my unit did come with nipples so not sure why the plumber would ditch them? Parts diagram shows the nipples as well.