Falling tiles on shower/bathtub

[dsshon]

The 1st row tiles above my shower/bathtub keeps falling out. I've had the tile guy redo it 3 times this past year.

It's a rental so I'm not sure I know exactly what's going on. All I know is that the tiles fall out and the mortar is wet but that moisture could be because the tiles are falling out and getting wet as they shower.

Is there a permanent way for me to attach my 3x6 ceramic tiles to the backer board and not have it fall out?

Is there a really strong waterproof thinset? I heard mastic might not be good because it breaks down when it gets wet.

 

[havasu]

Get a bucket of ready made AcrilPro, ceramic tile adhesive. You can find it at Lowes and Home Depot. It comes in a gallon size bucket. Make sure the surface is dry, apply the tile and let it set overnight, then grout it, let it set a few days, then use a good sealer on all the grout.

 

[Chris]

You really should not be having any tile pop off if thinset is used. Are the tiles porcelain?

 

[havasu]

I hope I'm wrong but tiles will usually only pop off if the backerboard is only drywall, and it has become wet. If this is the case, nothing short of a complete tear out will work correctly.

 

[frodo]

who told you the thinset is water proof?

what color is the sheet rock?

hate to breakit to you, but you use green board/or blue board

and the wall gets WATER PROOFED before the tile is set

then it is set using a mastic, then grouted

their is no watr proof thinset.

 

[havasu]

I myself hate any type of gypsum board, whether it be white, blue, black or green in a wet area. That is the area that should have only a concrete durock type of substance.

 

[Chris]

I haven't found a waterproof mastic. They all seem to be water based and get soft in showers. Back when I was a tile guy we floated the shower walls then used white thinset to stick the tile. Never had one pop off going that route.

 

[Chris]

Thinset is pretty much mortar but with more lime and some other lime type product.

 

[dsshon]

It's ceramic tiles. There is durock backerboard. The tiler used a traditional thin set.

I'm starting to think the tub may not have been secured properly and might be shifting as I hear ticking when I walk on the steel enamel tub.

 

[havasu]

Here is a trick. Fill the tub with water, which will add a few hundred pounds of weight. Then use the adhesive I wrote about in an earlier post, and follow the instructions. That should do the trick.....unless the durock was not installed properly.

 

[frodo]

what kind of tub is it? is it a plastic Sterling tub from ho depot?


if the tub moves, while your in it, or flex's any at all

 

[dsshon]

Here is a trick. Fill the tub with water, which will add a few hundred pounds of weight. Then use the adhesive I wrote about in an earlier post, and follow the instructions. That should do the trick.....unless the durock was not installed properly.

Interesting...what would be the benefit of this?

 

[havasu]

By adding the weight from the water, the tub will be settled down as low as possible so when the grout and caulking are applied, it will ensure better, full adhesion.

 

[frodo]

you have 1 of 2 problems

your tub is moving, not set correctly

or

the wrong rock is behind your tub...it is wet, the mastic is coming loose


stand on your tub, with one foot on the lip against the wall, the other fot on the lip in front of the tub.

do a little dance, shift your weight back and forth. , try and rock the tub.

if installed corectly, it will not move, if it moves you got a problem


the rock...you can see it.

what color is the sheet rock? blue or green is good. cement is good

whit is a problem


3rd..yeah i said 2, i lied

the rock, is it sitting on the tub or above the lip of the tub

see bad drawing for clarification

 

[dsshon]

So I'm hoping I found the root cause. The very 1st time, the tile came lose, the installer said it was never caulked. He re-did it but gave me the caulk and asked me to caulk it. The tiles came lose again 3 months later and he re-tiled and re-caulked.

Fast forward 3 months to two days ago, he said he used a thinset that expands when it gets wet. I asked why it would get wet when it was caulked. He didn't give a good answer. I asked if it was possible the tub was moving, he said no. Anyway, he put a different thinset and said asked me to re-caulk.

Today, I went to Home Depot to get the Polyblend tile caulk he used. I read the instructions. It said "Do not use in areas with constant water exposure" I'm hoping this is the cause though it said you can use it in showers which is kind of contradictory.

Also, in Frodo's drawing, I've read in many how-to's that you should leave your at least 1/4" gap between your backboard and gap? Oh and to answer your previous question, it's an American Standard enamel steel tub

 

[frodo]

american standard steel tub has holes in te lip for nailing to the framing. if the tub as a backer board under the lip and is naile

that is not the problem.


again, i ask .

what type of rock is behind the tile?

was the rock water proofed BEFORE tile was applied ?

OR...was tile just stuck to the rock using a """ It said "Do not use in areas with constant water exposure" """

I think you know your answer, In my opinion.

the whole thing needs to be removed and done correctly.

I would

contact, confront the tile installer. give them the option of making it right;

or you go facebook, angie list, craig list, BBB on his butt till he cant get any work.

but, i am confrontational.

 

[dsshon]

It's durock backer board which I answered on #9. No water proofing was done. He applied thinset and then tile.

What is that he did incorrectly? Was it not waterproofing the backer board and that's what's causing the tile to become loose? It's only the bottom row that came loose. Waterproofing the walls seems like a recent thing and was not done in the past...

My comment on "do not use in areas with constant water exposure" was on the caulk he used btw.

 

[KULTULZ]

...

I've read in many how-to's that you should leave your at least 1/4" gap between your backboard and gap?

... it's an American Standard enamel steel tub

Correct, you leave the gap (tile over tub tile flange and 1/4in above tub rim) and it is filled with mildew resistant silicon caulk (requires periodic maintenance). If the tub is not set correctly, it will drop when water and a persons weight is introduced. When drained the tub will raise in height and is not to contact the tile directly (only flexible caulk) as the rim may loosen tiling. Once water gets behind one tile, seepage/wicking will get it to all.

Tiles are not to be laid directly over sheet rock (paper faced) as none of them are water-proof. Green is for high humidity areas and blue for plaster. Neither are meant for direct water contact as in tiling as the grout lines will leak even if sealed on a regular basis. This is what Duroc is for although it (cement board) will break down with water seepage/contact.

There are several new waterproofing systems on the market.