Constant pressure pump, 20 gal tank, low pressure from faucets with 2 or more faucets open

[Twowaxhack]

If the pump is working correctly you should be able to read the amps go up and down when you turn on and off the load on the pump by opening/closing faucets.

Do it with a 1” pipe open at the well with a ball valve to open and close as you watch your amp meter.

Do the same with faucets in the house.

I wouldn’t use any hot water inside during this test. I know that tankless water heater restricts volume, most all water heaters do, tankless and conventional.

Also at normal water heater set temps most of your showers mixed temp is using hot water.

For Example:
A water heater with a thermostat setting of 120° F and the cold water inlet temperature is 50° F and the shower temperature is 110° F would use 86% HOT water and 14% COLD water.

 

[MicEd69]

If it’s never worked correctly then that rules out a lot.

Again, I’d open a 1” pipe at the well and see what kind of flow and pressure I get.

But once you open 3 faucets with normal house plumbing you’re naturally going to get a drop in volume……that’s just common sense.


Then I’d look into getting city water and throw the toys in a dumpster.

Pump curve graphs are great but what’s on paper doesn’t mean the customers pump is actually making that. That’s what it’s “ suppose “ to do.

Open a pipe at the well……..let it run. Now go inside and see if you still have great pressure with one faucet running.

See if opening faucets inside the house affect the flow outside at the pump where you have a pipe open.

If opening faucets inside affect the flow at the open pipe at the pump……then your pump is not putting out the water you think it’s is.

As this has been a problem from the start. Either the pump has always been faulty, or the issue is simply the pressure drops inherent in the system. But as the problem has not gotten worse over 5 years of operation, I suspect it is an issue with the plumbing system. One issue that could very well be a problem is the possible use of PEX, without taking into account the reduced flow through a 3/4" PEX line versus a 3/4" copper line.

I don't think you really understand the number of wells there are in rural America. I grew up on a farm with a 596 foot deep well; fresh, cool, clean water. I don't know where Mrpalazzolo is located, but while I expect there are "city folks" who have wells, my answers to questions about wells on this forum are directed towards their questions, with the assumption they are in a rural area where city water will never be an option.

 

[Twowaxhack]

As this has been a problem from the start. Either the pump has always been faulty, or the issue is simply the pressure drops inherent in the system. But as the problem has not gotten worse over 5 years of operation, I suspect it is an issue with the plumbing system. One issue that could very well be a problem is the possible use of PEX, without taking into account the reduced flow through a 3/4" PEX line versus a 3/4" copper line.

I don't think you really understand the number of wells there are in rural America. I grew up on a farm with a 596 foot deep well; fresh, cool, clean water. I don't know where Mrpalazzolo is located, but while I expect there are "city folks" who have wells, my answers to questions about wells on this forum are directed towards their questions, with the assumption they are in a rural area where city water will never be an option.

I don’t think you understand how many people are on city water and how many people switch from wells to city water every year. Look it up.

I post on this forum to solve problems, not to push well water or well equipment. If that means connecting to city water if it’s available then so be it.

 

[MicEd69]

I post on this forum to solve problems

Me too.

 

[Twowaxhack]

How many people live in America ?
332 million.

How many people rely on private well water ? About 50 million at best.

Are private wells the future of America or is public provided water services and utility companies our future ?

https://www.epa.gov/privatewells

 

[MicEd69]

How many people live in America ?
332 million.

How many people rely on private well water ? About 50 million at best.

Are private wells the future of America or is public provided water services and utility companies our future ?

https://www.epa.gov/privatewells

There is NO WAY government provided water will be available for even most of rural America. Electricity is one thing, but the infrastructure required for a distributed water system across all of America is absolutely cost prohibitive and technologically impossible. I don't think city dwellers will agree for the government to use their tax money to pay for Installing pumps, water towers, and water treating facilities across America for the rural folks. It just will NEVER happen!

 

[Twowaxhack]

There is NO WAY government provided water will be available for even most of rural America. Electricity is one thing, but the infrastructure required for a distributed water system across all of America is absolutely cost prohibitive and technologically impossible. I don't think city dwellers will agree for the government to use their tax money to pay for Installing pumps, water towers, and water treating facilities across America for the rural folks. It just will NEVER happen!

Compare America’s infrastructure from 200 years ago to now.

Ok, now imagine 200 years into America’s future. Year 2223

They’re constantly running water and sewer into rural areas around south Alabama. Population is constantly growing.

 

[Valveman]

Maybe in another 200 years there will be a municipal water line to every house, which means there will be no more rural America. I don't want to live in a world like that. I hope humans figure out we have an over-population problem long before then. In the mean time it is just a waste of everyone's time to even mention connecting to city water when that option is not available, at least for another 200 years. Lol! Suggesting that people connect to a city water supply is not constructive advice in a pumps and wells forum. It is a waste of everyone's time.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Maybe in another 200 years there will be a municipal water line to every house, which means there will be no more rural America. I don't want to live in a world like that. I hope humans figure out we have an over-population problem long before then. In the mean time it is just a waste of everyone's time to even mention connecting to city water when that option is not available, at least for another 200 years. Lol! Suggesting that people connect to a city water supply is not constructive advice in a pumps and wells forum. It is a waste of everyone's time.

Connecting to city water is great advice if your wells is giving you problems and you haven’t considered the alternative of city water if it’s available.

I know this for fact because I run a plumbing business and a common request is to connect to city water because the pump is not reliable and must use electricity to operate and the lack of qualified people to repair a well is dwindling.

Sounds like you don’t want city water suggested because you sell well equipment. It’s funny you think you get to decide what’s a waste of time……if someone doesn’t want to read what I post then skip it.

Haveva budlight and relax.

 

[Twowaxhack]

The problem is his water treatment system for his WELL water is too restrictive.

A very common problem with water treatment systems.

I’d bet money on it.

 

[MicEd69]

Government is NOT the answer to everything. We do not elect the President by popular vote, but rather we elect them by an electoral college. If we did it by popular vote, rural America would die away, along with the city dwellers who rely on the rural workers. And again, I say they would NEVER allow their representatives to spend their tax money on a public water system that would require so much infrastructure from which they would not benefit. A lot of them believe their meat and vegetable come from the grocery stores. LOL!

As Valveman said, MAYBE in a couple of hundred years things will change. But there is absolutely NO WAY a public water system will be available for the even 25% of rural America in the foreseeable future.

If you want to comment about a well system question, either start off and ask if a city water supply is available or answer the question directly.

And the vast areas that use well water for crop irrigation will NEVER connect those systems to a public water supply. So, there will still be millions of wells supplying water for Americans even in 200 years.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Government is NOT the answer to everything. We do not elect the President by popular vote, but rather we elect them by an electoral college. If we did it by popular vote, rural America would die away, along with the city dwellers who rely on the rural workers. And again, I say they would NEVER allow their representatives to spend their tax money on a public water system that would require so much infrastructure from which they would not benefit. A lot of them believe their meat and vegetable come from the grocery stores. LOL!

As Valveman said, MAYBE in a couple of hundred years things will change. But there is absolutely NO WAY a public water system will be available for the even 25% of rural America in the foreseeable future.

If you want to comment about a well system question, either start off and ask if a city water supply is available or answer the question directly.

And the vast areas that use well water for crop irrigation will NEVER connect those systems to a public water supply. So, there will still be millions of wells supplying water for Americans even in 200 years.

Crop irrigation can be different than potable water. Totally different application.

As far as the cost, that’s not stopping the infrastructure being installed. In fact there are often incentives and grants to pay to even have the yard lines ran from the meter to the house for Free.

My father in law and thousands more are getting forced sewer mains installed in there neighborhood. There are grants being given to thousands of people to have a sewage grinder system installed free of charge. No income qualifications, it’s free to everyone.

The county I live in just finished about 10 miles of potable water piping out into the county. A brand new water main. It costs about $500 to connect and the average homes uses about $40 a month for water.

More pipe is being installed, not more wells. The only people who wants a well is agriculture or manufacturing if they have any common sense. It simply costs more to maintain a well and treat the water if it’s done properly and tested every year.

Facts……

Thanks for your opinion.

 

[MicEd69]

Crop irrigation can be different than potable water. Totally different application.

We are talking about well pumps and the solutions to pump and system problems. The pump doesn't know what water it is pumping.

"incentives and grants to pay"

Yep, that's what I want! More government entry into my life and entitlements that never go away! NOT!!!!

 

[Twowaxhack]

Crop irrigation can be different than potable water. Totally different application.

We are talking about well pumps and the solutions to pump and system problems. The pump doesn't know what water it is pumping.

"incentives and grants to pay"

Yep, that's what I want! More government entry into my life and entitlements that never go away! NOT!!!!

Brilliant.

 

[Valveman]

the lack of qualified people to repair a well is dwindling.

Haveva budlight and relax.

This is the only thing I agree with you about. The lack of qualified people to do ANYTHING is not just dwindling, it is a disaster. Everybody wants to just have water and power piped to their house and the waste piped and hauled away. Where do you think all that money for "grants" comes from? It is certainly not "free to everyone". It is costing all of us more ways than you can imagine. Lack of qualified anybody's to do anything for a start. People just want to sit at home and have everything handed to them for free. Your government will be glad to do EVERYTHING for you, all you have to do is "bend the knee". Your government is here to help you. Forced sewers first, forced city water next, then whatever they want. So, bend the knee, haveva budlight and relax my friend.

 

[Twowaxhack]

This is the only thing I agree with you about. The lack of qualified people to do ANYTHING is not just dwindling, it is a disaster. Everybody wants to just have water and power piped to their house and the waste piped and hauled away. Where do you think all that money for "grants" comes from? It is certainly not "free to everyone". It is costing all of us more ways than you can imagine. Lack of qualified anybody's to do anything for a start. People just want to sit at home and have everything handed to them for free. Your government will be glad to do EVERYTHING for you, all you have to do is "bend the knee". Your government is here to help you. Forced sewers first, forced city water next, then whatever they want. So, bend the knee, haveva budlight and relax my friend.

The government has been picking winners and losers from the beginning.

Nothing new here, move along.

 

[Valveman]

The government has been picking winners and losers from the beginning.

Nothing new here, move along.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. Everything is peaches and crème, just believe me. Lol!

 

[Mrpalazzolo]

Figured out the bypass directions were a bit incorrect, so I did get them set up correctly. I was able to bypass both of the softener and the iron filter. There was some slight improvement with water pressure at the taps when bypassed. Not sure how much as I would need to get a gauge installed, but it was noticeable. The PSI at the well pump maintained the same pressure readings as before. The entire system was installed prior to us moving in, so we don't know how it worked prior to the water softener installation. City water is not available, however we do have city sewer.
I also looked at my PEX diameters. Coming from the pump directly through the basement wall is 1.25" OD which then runs about 1 foot into brass valves at the Wellmate (apparently 29.5 gal) pressure tank. With the constant pressure pump, we were told (and read) there isn't a need to have the large pressure tank, as the pump will compensate for increased demand without decreasing pressure, hence why we paid more for that type of pump. It would be like we had city water. See attached photo. Then it necks down to 1" OD PEX (marked 3/4" I am guessing that means ID), which then runs about 50 feet to the water softener. All PEX into and out of the softener are 1" OD. Then, it runs up and over probably about 8 feet to the tankless water heater. Several PEX tubes are necked down to 3/4" OD just prior reaching the taps, while most of the main runs are still 1" OD. All elbows are just the black plastic 90 degree ones, and there's a lot of them. Pressure decreases most at all taps when the washing machine is in its filling cycle, even when just 1 other tap is open, with a decrease of over 50%. I need to try the washing machine with the softener bypassed and see what that does. Maybe our softener service/bypass valves are compromised somehow?

 

[Twowaxhack]

It’s best if you use I.D. only, inside diameter is how water pipe is sized.

On the cold distribution all the main runs should be 1” I.D. Pex and keep the fittings to a minimum.

Pex was designed to bend and roll rather than use fittings everywhere.

Excess fittings should be eliminated.

1/2” pex is 5/8” outside diameter
3/4” pex is 7/8” outside diameter
1” pex is 1 1/8” outside diameter

All valves should be full port.

 

[Mrpalazzolo]

It’s best if you use I.D. only, inside diameter is how water pipe is sized.

On the cold distribution all the main runs should be 1” I.D. Pex and keep the fittings to a minimum.

Pex was designed to bend and roll rather than use fittings everywhere.

Excess fittings should be eliminated.

1/2” pex is 5/8” outside diameter
3/4” pex is 7/8” outside diameter
1” pex is 1 1/8” outside diameter

All valves should be full port.

Thanks for this. All cold water and hot water distribution lines are marked 3/4", except for the feeder lines to the faucets which are marked 1/2".