How to fix old shower down pipe with worn threads

[BikeRider64]

While recently trying to install a new wand showerhead onto the shower down pipe, I noticed that the male threads on the end of the pipe were pretty worn and I could turn the plastic female part of the showerhead continually without enough resistance to make it impossible to keep turning it (at least without enough force to strip the plastic threads). Using white teflon tape I could just make it tight enough to avoid leaks, but I could sense that I could turn it further if I tried.

Additionally, we needed to lower the new showerhead enough so it wouldn't be a tough reach, so I bought a 7" brass shower pipe extension, but when I tried to install it, the connection was even looser than with the plastic part, and no amount of tape would solidly connect the two pipes.

I assume that the correct solution would be to replace the down pipe with a new one with good threads. But we rent and I'm pretty sure that the landlord isn't going to be willing to hire a plumber to do it (long story not worth getting into). Plus it's a 65 year old apartment and the pipe looks original, and if I try to replace it myself I'm concerned that I'll break it off inside the wall and thus require making a hole in the wall to fix it and all the complexity that this would entail. When I gently tried to unscrew the down pipe, it wouldn't budge, so I didn't proceed further.

I'm wondering if it's possible to either repair the threads on the existing pipe, using a die and wrench with cutting oil, or perhaps some sort of thread repair compound if there is such a thing, or coat the threads with something like Megaloc or Real Tuff and maybe tape as well? The pipe appears to be either brass or steel. There's a greenish patina on parts of it, which suggests brass to me. It's likely also from the mid-50's. Any chance it's copper?

Basically, I'm looking for the least "intrusive" solution that actually works. If none exist, then I'll just reinstall the old showerhead, which for whatever reason does make a tight fit with the pipe, and just live with it. Hopefully though there is a solution that would work.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Most shower head and shower components rely on a rubber washer to seal the threads. I typically don’t use any Teflon tape.

 

[BikeRider64]

There's a rubber washer in the female part, so it's not and end seal issue The issue is that the male threads on the shower down pipe have worn down so that the crests are likely lower than they should be and the valleys wider. It's basically been tightened and untightened so many times that metal has been removed from the sides and tops of the threads over the years. We're talking 65 years worth.

 

[Twowaxhack]

There's a rubber washer in the female part, so it's not and end seal issue The issue is that the male threads on the shower down pipe have worn down so that the crests are likely lower than they should be and the valleys wider. It's basically been tightened and untightened so many times that metal has been removed from the sides and tops of the threads over the years. We're talking 65 years worth.

Replace the pipe. It should unscrew counterclockwise out of the wall.

They can break off in the wall on occasion. Hopefully yours won’t do that.

 

[BikeRider64]

And that's the thing, as I explained. Not easily or safely done and if I break it at the other end there's way more work to be done, and we rent, so it's complicated. Do older pipes tend to seize or can penetrating oil loosen them enough to safely remove by hand without risk of snapping them off?

I can probably drill a small hole in the wall to stick one of those thing plastic straws that come with spray oil to get oil on the threads. Or I can just remove the plaster or drywall surrounding the pipe to get a better view and access, then seal it with plaster when I'm done, so no one's the wiser. Plus the escutcheon should cover it.

But I was hoping to avoid replacing the pipe if possible. Can worn threads be repaired? Or, would I be able to cut new threads past the old ones, using the old ones as guides, then cut off the end of the pipe to remove the old threads?

 

[Twowaxhack]

That’s the chance you have to take if you want it to work. I doubt you could cut and cut new threads in place, I’d be really surprised if you could do that.

I’d try to unscrew it or call the landlord and let him replace his bad pipe.

 

[BikeRider64]

Any reason you don't think I could cut new threads? Are these pipes made out metal that requires cutting tools beyond an average DIYer's range and expertise, or which requires first removing the pipe, which if I could do it would obviously obviate the need to cut new threads? I don't mean to be a pain with the questions or am doubting your advice, I genuinely want to know.

As for the landlord, the less said the better. It's complicated. Suffice it to say that he's refused all but the absolutely most necessary of fixes and it in a position to get away with it, for reasons having to do with NYC's horrible rent laws.

 

[TomFOhio]

It is not very easy to cut and thread a 1/2 pipe on a pipe stand without moving the stand some. If you start cranking
on that pipe coming out the wall you got a lot better chance of breaking something in that wall. Try finding a
shower outfit that is made of metal instead of plastic. Is your old shower head metal or plastic.

 

[BikeRider64]

The old (not original) shower head is metal, at least the collar or sleeve that connects to the shower pipe. The extension pipe I got is also metal, chrome-played brass.

Looks like my best if not only bet it to somehow remove the old pipe and replace it with a new one. I'll give it a shot and by very careful, and prepare myself for a more complex fix than I hoped, if it breaks.

Shower pipes are typically male on both ends, right?

 

[TomFOhio]

Your correct. Put your wrench on close to the wall and very slowly try turning the pipe counterclockwise.

 

[BikeRider64]

I was at Home Depot today and picked up a bunch of items that I'm hoping will resolve this issue. In addition to a new shower pipe, I got some of the better quality Oatey grey tape, 2 kinds of sealant, Megaloc and Real Tuff, a 1/2" Galvanized Malleable Iron FPT x FPT Coupling, and a 1/2" x 6" Galvanized Steel Nipple.

Obviously I won't use all of these and will return the ones that I don't use. But the coupling seemed to securely fit onto the existing shower pipe, the nipple fit into the coupling, and the shower head fit into the nipple. There was a slight amount of leaking, but it was a quick fit without tools, tape or sealant, so that was to be expected.

I think this MIGHT resolve this, as well as provide an extension to lower the new shower head. The nipple & coupler are a bit heavier than the brass pipe extension I got, but that made a very poor fit onto the shower pipe, far less secure than the coupling. I wonder if the "malleable" attribute is what made up for the worn threads on the shower pipe?

If this does fix this issue, what kind of sealant should I use, the tape, or one of the liquid sealants, and if so which one, the Megaloc or Real Tuff? Or tape AND sealant, to be sure?

Or, is this a bad idea and short cut that will fail eventually, and I really have no choice but to replace the shower pipe if I want to do this right?

 

[MicEd69]

All pipe threads are tapered, and the brass fittings you have are usually used for "fine work" and not "rough work". I suspect that the galvanized coupling screwed on farther and engaged more threads of the "worn" pipe than the brass fitting did. I've not used those brands of thread sealant, but it looks like the Real Tuff spec sheets shows it is a heavier paste. I would use it over the other one and especially over tape. And definitely don't use both tape and thread sealant. Over time, you will get some rust with the galvanized fittings, but I wouldn't worry about it. My assumption is when you leave, you will replace the extension with the old shower head, or the landlord may withhold some of your deposit to get a certified plumber at $125/hr. to come in and unscrew your extension and replace the shower head.

 

[BikeRider64]

All pipe threads are tapered, and the brass fittings you have are usually used for "fine work" and not "rough work". I suspect that the galvanized coupling screwed on farther and engaged more threads of the "worn" pipe than the brass fitting did. I've not used those brands of thread sealant, but it looks like the Real Tuff spec sheets shows it is a heavier paste. I would use it over the other on and especially over tape. And definitely don't use both tape and thread sealant. Over time, you will get some rust with the galvanized fittings, but I wouldn't worry about it. My assumption is when you leave, you will replace the extension with the old shower head, or the landlord may withhold some of your deposit to get a certified plumber at $125/hr. to come in and unscrew your extension and replace the shower head.

I installed the coupler and nipple and that made for a MUCH more secure and tight fit onto the existing shower pipe, I assume for the reasons you stated. There was still a very tiny leak between the coupler and pipe, but I only used tape (the better, grey Oatey kind) and didn't tighten the coupler as far as I probably could have, using only my hands and no wrench.

But this does seem to have resolved the issue of the old pipe having worn threads, and I just have to seal and tighten things properly. We'll see how it holds up over time. At worst I'll be back where I started and have to replace the pipe or somehow extend the existing threads inward. Hopefully that won't be necessary. It is kind of "ugly" though.

As for sealing the threads, I'm confused by what you wrote above:

"I would use it over the other on and especially over tape. And definitely don't use both tape and thread sealant."

Don't the two sentences contradict each other, and which is it, tape + sealant or just tape or sealant?

As for sealant, I picked up a small tube of both Megaloc and Real Tuff as I wasn't sure which is better for this application. Turns out that I also have a small tube of Permatex 95235 High Temp Thread Sealant left over from some recent work I did replacing the water pumps and thermostats on some cars.

Which of these is the more suitable for this sort of application? I think the first two are solvent-based and the third might be resin-based (i.e. it doesn't shrink as it sets) but I'm not sure.

 

[MicEd69]

I installed the coupler and nipple and that made for a MUCH more secure and tight fit onto the existing shower pipe, I assume for the reasons you stated. There was still a very tiny leak between the coupler and pipe, but I only used tape (the better, grey Oatey kind) and didn't tighten the coupler as far as I probably could have, using only my hands and no wrench.

But this does seem to have resolved the issue of the old pipe having worn threads, and I just have to seal and tighten things properly. We'll see how it holds up over time. At worst I'll be back where I started and have to replace the pipe or somehow extend the existing threads inward. Hopefully that won't be necessary. It is kind of "ugly" though.

As for sealing the threads, I'm confused by what you wrote above:



Don't the two sentences contradict each other, and which is it, tape + sealant or just tape or sealant?

As for sealant, I picked up a small tube of both Megaloc and Real Tuff as I wasn't sure which is better for this application. Turns out that I also have a small tube of Permatex 95235 High Temp Thread Sealant left over from some recent work I did replacing the water pumps and thermostats on some cars.

Which of these is the more suitable for this sort of application? I think the first two are solvent-based and the third might be resin-based (i.e. it doesn't shrink as it sets) but I'm not sure.

I assume you meant you had Permatex 59235 which should not be used for this application. That's for automotive work, hence the high temperature.

And yes, my grammar left a little bit to be desired there. I didn't proofread my response before I posted it. It is definitely confusing the way I put it.

What I meant to say was, "I would 'choose to use' Real Tuff over rather than Megaloc, and for sure would 'choose to use' Real Tuff over rather than tape. Definitely don't use both tape and a thread sealant together. Like I said, I've not used either of these two thread sealants, but as the Real Tuff appears to be thicker and therefore should contain the high amount of solids, that would be my choice.

Sorry for the confusion.

 

[BikeRider64]

Ah, got it, thanks. However I've come across advice saying that in some cases it's ok to apply tape then sealant. Is that never the case, or only for other kinds of applications? I think that the maker of these sealants said this but can't recall for sure.

Also, as I wrote the solution I found worked, but the nipple I used was too long at 8", making the showerhead stick out too far into the bathtub, plus I'm concerned that pressure applied to the wand on removal and reinsertion will weaken the pipe connection in the wall over time. I'll replace it with a shorter piece, probably 1.5-2".

If someone made a 45 degree or so nipple or short piece of pipe, that would be ideal as it would bring the showerhead down without having it stick too far into the tub, but I haven't found anything like that. I've seen adjustable Z-stye swinging extensions that can be locked into various positions on both ends, but that's getting overly complicated and just adds more potential points of failure or leakage.

 

[TomFOhio]

Look up 1/2" chrome 45 degree ellbow on the web and it will give you many ideas.

 

[Twowaxhack]

https://www.amazon.com/Shower-Head-Swivel-Ball-Adapter/dp/B075W8N5TP

 

[BikeRider64]

Look up 1/2" chrome 45 degree ellbow on the web and it will give you many ideas.

Thanks, will do.

https://www.amazon.com/Shower-Head-Swivel-Ball-Adapter/dp/B075W8N5TP

Thanks, interesting.

I've decided though to keep it simple for now and just focus on resolving the worn shower pipe threads issue. Ideally I'd use a short pipe extension of around 1-2" made of soft iron or brass, but I can't seem to find one at HD, so instead I'll use the coupler I picked up the other day but with a shorter nipple than the 8" one I got, the shortest one I can find.

Once that's done and I'm satisfied that it works, I'll think about getting fancy with the angles and lowering the showerhead. One step at a time.

 

[BikeRider64]

Quick followup. After some trial and error, I think I've found a practical solution to this issue. Upon the advice of folks here I looked for and found a 45 degree elbow coupling at HD, and installed it onto the existing shower pipe with the worn threads, using the better grey Oatey thread tape. I then threaded a 6" nipple into that, using the same tape, and then the shower head onto that. Works great, no leaks, no need to replace the shower pipe and risk breaking it off inside the wall, and the shower head is now at the perfect height and distance from the wall. Thanks all!

 

[Twowaxhack]

Take a pic, I’d love to see it.