Well tank install - cheaper tanks...

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jb59

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I always thought if you built a better mousetrap, people would beat a path to your door. I found out marketing is more important than efficiency. If you make a mouse trap so well that it can make mice extinct, the mousetrap industry will try to discredit you and do everything in their power to put you out of business. There is a lot of money in mouse traps, but there is even more in pump systems.

When I approached the pump manufacturers in 1994 with the CSV, claiming it made pumps last longer, which it does, they gave me all kinds of excuses. First it was lead in the valve. Next month I called them and said all CSV's are now low or no lead. Still more excuses. Then just kept procrastinating and saying they were still studying it. Four years later, one of the head engineers retired and called asking to be set up as a rep for the CSV. Said since he no longer worked there, he could now tell me why they would never work with me. Seems I had been blacklisted. A company meeting showed me testing valves in their facility with their engineers. Said test showed this valve would make pumps last longer and use smaller tanks. So, anyone who mentioned a CSV would be fired immediately.

People are so gullible. Like me, no one believes something like that would happen. They don't really have the cure for pump cancer and are just not telling anyone about it, would they? Not only did they not tell anyone, they threatened termination to anyone who did. They also started a dis-information campaign to make people think restricting a pump with a valve is a bad thing. It is so counter intuitive that they don't have to say much to make some people go crazy over it. People fall for their little statements saying it is like "driving a car with one foot on the brake and one one the gas", or like "dragging a ball and chain". But you won't find a single written statement or video from any pump manufacturer saying anything negative about Cycle Stop Valves. It is all hearsay. They pump up their installers at hot dog days and on trips they sponsor and get them to do the dirty work. Like this from a driller or installer which is something we hear everyday.
I am so glad I posted a question on this forum about well pumps. Thank you for taking the time to reply. Very informative. Loved the video. I know what you mean about marketing over efficiency.

Right now the tank is nearly useless so I have to act fairly quickly about replacing what's down there. If I can find one of those cycle stop valves I'll be getting a smaller tank. Thanks again for your help.
 

jb59

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Not only does the Cycle Stop Valve make pumps last longer and use smaller tanks, but it makes for much better water pressure. Some like to call it "city like" constant pressure. I say it is your own water system and you can have much better than any city water pressure if you want. A city generally gives about 50 PSI of fairly steady pressure. Most pump systems run on a 40/60 pressure switch, giving an average of 50 PSI as the pump is cycling it self to death between 40 and 60. Just adding a Cycle Stop Valve set to deliver a strong constant 50 PSI will make the pressure much stronger than on at 40 and off at 60 over and over. But you can turn the switch up to 50/70 or higher, and set the CSV to deliver a constant 60, 70, or even more if needed. But 50 or 60 constant is enough that people tell me they no longer need soap in the shower. And 70 or 80 would clean the grout on the back wall if you step out of the way. Lol! Also, constant pressure makes every size sprinkler zone hit exactly the right spot, all the way out to the corners, every time around. Not to mention, no matter what you do with the water, the pump is not cycling on/off repeatedly, which is what normally destroys all pumps.
Thank you. I'm sold. Getting one today as soon as I get off work.
 

Valveman

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Thank you! Like I told the youtube guy, Cycle Stop Valves is a legitimate company with a patented product. I have been building, selling, and standing behind these valves from the same location for 30 years. I am sitting at my desk and can answer any questions you may have. Lol! Sad the youtube guy thinks he is too smart to ask questions, as he could use a lot of help.
Cary 806-885-4445
 
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jb59

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Thank you! Like I told the youtube guy, Cycle Stop Valves is a legitimate company with a patented product. I have been building, selling, and standing behind these valves from the same location for 30 years. I am sitting at my desk and can answer any questions you may have. How many Snake oil salesmen can say that? Lol! Sad the youtube guy thinks he is too smart to ask questions, as he could use a lot of help.
Cary 806-885-4445
I was just looking at your website, at least I think that's your website. I see you sell a PK1A Pressure Tank Kit. Is that tank big enough for a normal sized house?
 

Valveman

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I was just looking at your website, at least I think that's your website. I see you sell a PK1A Pressure Tank Kit. Is that tank big enough for a normal sized house?
Yep! Before the CSV I would have recommended as large a tank as you could get through the door, and two would have been better. But for the last 30 years using a CSV means a much smaller tank, down to the 4.5 gallon size is all you need for a normal house at 40/60 pressure.

The 10 gallon size tank is still all that is needed when using higher pressures like 50/70, 60/80 or so, or when you have a very large house or even two houses on the same well.

We use 80 gallon size pressure tanks on an entire city of say 40K people, with a much larger pump or pumps and much larger Cycle Stop Valves.

Oh and here is a picture of a 3,000 GPM city pump system with an 80 gallon size pressure tank.


INOVA COMPLETE LARGE A.jpg
 
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jb59

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Yep! Before the CSV I would have recommended as large a tank as you could get through the door, and two would have been better. But for the last 30 years using a CSV means a much smaller tank, down to the 4.5 gallon size is all you need for a normal house at 40/60 pressure.

The 10 gallon size tank is still all that is needed when using higher pressures like 50/70, 60/80 or so, or when you have a very large house or even two houses on the same well.

We use 80 gallon size pressure tanks on an entire city of say 40K people, with a much larger pump or pumps and much larger Cycle Stop Valves.

Oh and here is a picture of a 3,000 GPM city pump system with an 80 gallon size pressure tank.
That's incredible.

Our grey water pump is on a sand mound and when the power goes out, which happens a lot because of where we live - a lot of the lines are old and are not being upgraded. Can you recommend a better system for this as well?

Our house has 3 bathrooms but 2 are full bath and our furnace uses water also. It's a oil/hot water heater. Not sure if I said this correctly.

Lastly, this is the system we have now in our basement (picture attached). The water comes from outside (from the left) and the shut off valve is to the right. To the right of that - it goes to our water filter, and then into the house. We want to add two more water filters to where we'll have one pleated filter, one charcoal filter and one silver filter. Would this small tank be able to handle all of this?

Thank you again sir for your help with this. I won't bombard you with any more questions.

V/r

Joe
 

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jb59

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Thank you! Like I told the youtube guy, Cycle Stop Valves is a legitimate company with a patented product. I have been building, selling, and standing behind these valves from the same location for 30 years. I am sitting at my desk and can answer any questions you may have. How many Snake oil salesmen can say that? Lol! Sad the youtube guy thinks he is too smart to ask questions, as he could use a lot of help.
Cary 806-885-4445
Just pulled the trigger and bought it. Looking forward to having this in my basement. Thanks again.
 

sarg

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Just an opinion ..... your "water system" is not where you want to go cheap. You will never regret using the CSV
 

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Valveman

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That's incredible.

Our grey water pump is on a sand mound and when the power goes out, which happens a lot because of where we live - a lot of the lines are old and are not being upgraded. Can you recommend a better system for this as well?

Our house has 3 bathrooms but 2 are full bath and our furnace uses water also. It's a oil/hot water heater. Not sure if I said this correctly.

Lastly, this is the system we have now in our basement (picture attached). The water comes from outside (from the left) and the shut off valve is to the right. To the right of that - it goes to our water filter, and then into the house. We want to add two more water filters to where we'll have one pleated filter, one charcoal filter and one silver filter. Would this small tank be able to handle all of this?

Thank you again sir for your help with this. I won't bombard you with any more questions.

V/r

Joe
Sorry for the delay. Keeping the granddaughter a couple days is all I can do and wears me out, but I love it.

That tank is more than enough, as the 4.5 gallon tank that comes in the complete PK1A kit is all you need. But the CSV1A valve will work with any size tank, especially if it is an existing tank that is still good. However, going through so many filters you will lose at least 10 PSI. So when you turn up the pressure from 4/60 to 50/70 or higher to accommodate, a little larger tank is needed because of the higher pressure. I would run 50/70 and set the CSV1A at 65 PSI constant, and you won't even need soap in the shower. Lol!

Don't understand the grey water system and sand mound thing, But could probably figure it out with a little more explanation?
 

Valveman

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Just an opinion ..... your "water system" is not where you want to go cheap. You will never regret using the CSV
I agree. However, using a Cycle Stop Valve and small tank is one of the least expensive methods, even though it is also the best. :)
 

jb59

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Sorry for the delay. Keeping the granddaughter a couple days is all I can do and wears me out, but I love it.

That tank is more than enough, as the 4.5 gallon tank that comes in the complete PK1A kit is all you need. But the CSV1A valve will work with any size tank, especially if it is an existing tank that is still good. However, going through so many filters you will lose at least 10 PSI. So when you turn up the pressure from 4/60 to 50/70 or higher to accommodate, a little larger tank is needed because of the higher pressure. I would run 50/70 and set the CSV1A at 65 PSI constant, and you won't even need soap in the shower. Lol!

Don't understand the grey water system and sand mound thing, But could probably figure it out with a little more explanation?
Definitely understand about being busy with the granddaughter. Have a couple myself. They are hard to keep up with.

Maybe we'll keep it down to one filter then. But if we do use three, would I need a larger tank or would be turning up the pressure to 50/70 be enough?

The grey water/sand mound setup is how we have our sewage system set up. The pump we have out there is submersible. But I didn't see any products on your website for this setup.

I see the CSV is already on its way. Got notification a couple hours ago. That was quick!
 

Valveman

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The filters have nothing to do with tank size. Increasing the pressure from 40/60 to 50/70 is a reason to go with at least a 10 gallon tank instead of the 4.5. The more filters the more pressure you lose and the higher you need the pressure switch and CSV.
 

jb59

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The filters have nothing to do with tank size. Increasing the pressure from 40/60 to 50/70 is a reason to go with at least a 10 gallon tank instead of the 4.5. The more filters the more pressure you lose and the higher you need the pressure switch and CSV.
Understood. Since the 4.5 is already on the way, will it be able to handle the increased pressure? If not, I can just eliminate 2 of the filters until I get a larger tank.
 

Valveman

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You are fine but 50/70 is max for the 4.5 gallon tank. You will need the heavy duty pressure switch and a 10 gallon size tank if you want to use 60/80 or 70/90.
 

jb59

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The tank kit I ordered was originally scheduled to arrive yesterday but Fed Ex rescheduled it to next Monday. The water pressure in my existing setup is very weak. My family and I have done all we can to limit the use of water until the new tank arrives. I'm a little worried that this low pressure can affect the furnace, which draws water from the tank. I'm not sure if maybe we should get a hotel room until the new tank arrives and we can install it. Thanks for any advice.
 

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Have you tried airing up your existing tank? A new tank isn't going to improve your pressure or volume, it just prevents the pump from short-cycling. Drain all the water that you can get out of the tank, then add some air to the top until water stops coming out of the drain, then start up the system again, it should work fine for awhile.
 

jb59

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Have you tried airing up your existing tank? A new tank isn't going to improve your pressure or volume, it just prevents the pump from short-cycling. Drain all the water that you can get out of the tank, then add some air to the top until water stops coming out of the drain, then start up the system again, it should work fine for awhile.
For a couple weeks now, when the water pressure gets really slow, I've been draining all the water out (and lately there's been a lot of air too), then adding air back into it until it reached 28.

Someone told me this would work until we got a new well tank but for the past few weeks it hasn't helped much.
 

RS

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Then you have other problems.
 
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