Moen 1222 replacement thinks up is "off".

[murbot]

Hi,
I replaced a 1222 cartridge in a shower in my house that I installed 8 years ago. After struggling to get inserted, but finally getting it done with the rubber pieces set in place, in their grooves. The shower will feed water, but down should be off and it thinks it's on, then rt comes on, up turns it off completely, and left comes on again.

Does this ring any bells?

Thanks for any advice or suggestions.

-Steve

 

[Twowaxhack]

You you have the handle adapter installed correctly ?

If it has a handle adapter try reversing it.

 

[murbot]

You you have the handle adapter installed correctly ?

If it has a handle adapter try reversing it.

Doesn't really have an option to reverse. I took a picture of it in the off position when uninstalling and the black piece was facing the same direction as I'm holding it here (numbers upright). Notch in the metal pin was down during uninstall.
I tried removing it, turning the metal pin in the middle 180° and installing, but same result.

While installing, the pin got pushed back into the plastic making other parts come out the back end. I pulled the pin back through with no issue, but I wonder if maybe something spun 90° when that happened and threw off the cartridge. I defer to those with more experience to let me know if this is even possible.

Pardon the funky plate cover. Never looks that bad until it's in a photo.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Try spinning the brass stem 180 degrees

Water can stay on.

 

[murbot]

Try spinning the brass stem 180 degrees

Water can stay on.

Tried that a few times. Moen will send a replacement for a lemon cartridge.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Yeah, I hate moen products.

 

[Terrill]

For the 1222, H on left, C on right.
The brass stem has a notch on one side, that should be on the side facing down when the water is off.
Rotate counter clockwise, water starts off cold and gradually gets warm and then hot. If it starts off with hot, then the water supply to the valve has been reversed. If that is the case, the cartridge gets spun 180 degrees.




The notch faces down when the water is off.
The water would be on in this picture.

 

[havasu]

What is the reason for the clips on the water stops?

 

[Twowaxhack]

What is the reason for the clips on the water stops?

That’s what holds it together. It’s junk.

 

[TomFOhio]

Everyone has their personal preference on faucets. I prefer Moen over Delta.

 

[Terrill]

What is the reason for the clips on the water stops?

The clips hold the stops in place.

 

[havasu]

But the stops stay in to stop the flow of water? I guess it would just add resistance?
I'm just learning about these silly clipped stops. Give me Delta any day over this design.

 

[Steve_K2]

We had guests the other week, and they reported the same symptom as you, ie, OFF at top, etc.

After they left, I fixed it with a new cartridge. I think the new cartridge had the same issue, though, until I took out the brass screw assembly and turned it 180 degrees.

Whatever I did worked.

What I'm getting at, keep playing with it and it'll work right soon enough.

(I'm not a plumber, but you could tell that, I'm sure.)

 

[Ferdinand]

But the stops stay in to stop the flow of water? I guess it would just add resistance?
I'm just learning about these silly clipped stops. Give me Delta any day over this design.

The stops, when screwed all the way in, close off the water. That way you can work on replacing the stem without needing to turn off the water supply to the whole house.

If the stops are screwed all the way out, i.e. ALL the way without those clips in place, they'll come right out of the valve allowing you to replace their rubber seals if required. But in this case you better have shut off the water to the entire house or you'll have a torrent blowing out of the empty holes.

The clips are there to allow the stops to be unscrewed fully open, without allowing them to turn so far out that they blow right out of the fixture.

 

[havasu]

Thanks, that is what I figured. Seems someone uneducated would pull the clips, and have a blowout real fast. Seems to be a bad design.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Thanks, that is what I figured. Seems someone uneducated would pull the clips, and have a blowout real fast. Seems to be a bad design.

It’s 1/4 turn valve. The clip is the retainer they use to hold it together. It’s basically a serviceable ballvalve.

They use orings to seal the cartridge to the valve body.

The design has its plus and minus.

The explanation from Ferdinand is incorrect about how the clips and the valve operates.

 

[Ferdinand]

The explanation from Ferdinand is incorrect about how the clips and the valve operates.

My bad, as usual.

Twowaxhack is absolutely correct. These stop valves are 1/4 turn barrel valves, not threaded at all, only retained by the clips.

 

[havasu]

Good to know. Thanks for the knowledge.

 

[Zanne]

I will pipe in (see what I did there?) & suggest accessible shutoffs with some sort of access panel (if possible) so you don't have to shut off the water to the entire house. That's what I'm doing with my house reno. Shutoffs everywhere!

I hope murbot got this working properly now.

 

[murbot]

Alrighty...
I bought that 1222 (correct cartridge) at Ace. The shower is a 3 port (no tub faucet). I tried reseating it, turning it 180°...multiple times, around, back etc and keeping track as to land in the original position after the failures. No luck.
Called Moen and tried their suggestions - same result. They said it's likely a bad cartridge sent a replacement in 48 hrs.

Installed it with no shortage of trouble and 'meditative chanting' as my wife calls it. The first 5 attempts ended with the rt (cold) side rubber gasket sliding out (back toward me) as the last part of the gasket went in. I did the 50/50 vinegar/water rag, scrub with wire brush ==> force water out process, but it was still a bear to push the new one in.

I ended up using a quick grip clam to grab the back of the shower valve and the part of the cartridge that reads "HC" and VERY delicately squeezed it into place with the clamp while using a thumb and finger to squeeze/hold the rubber gaskets in place as the cartridge slid in. Still took a handful of attempts and one gasket tore so I used one from the first cartridge I purchased.

It works. We have a working, non leaking shower as of yesterday.

Now I just need to figure out if pressure relief valve leak at my well tank is the valve itself or the 40/60 meter that's running up to 80. Starting to think that's what caused the 4 other leaks I've found/patched in the last week. LOL

Thanks for the help and advice.