Is this legal?

Discussion in 'General Plumbing Help' started by JackJ, Jan 17, 2015.

Help Support Plumbing Forums by donating:

  1. Jan 17, 2015 #1

    JackJ

    JackJ

    JackJ

    Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2015
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    ,
    Can a shower be the wet vent for a toilet assuming the shower has a proper vent on it of course?

    Put another way. See below picture. Is this legal?

    Background: Space constraints prevent me from wet venting the toilet with the lavatory while complying with code and leaving ample counter space.

    Untitledjhgjhg.jpg
     
  2. Jan 17, 2015 #2

    frodo

    frodo

    frodo

    Just call me Macgyver Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,400
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    Location:
    ,
    no that is not legal in upc code.. where are you located?
     
  3. Jan 17, 2015 #3

    Matt30

    Matt30

    Matt30

    Professional Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,092
    Likes Received:
    807
    Location:
    Halifax, Nova Scotia
    Where are you putting the basin?
     
  4. Jan 17, 2015 #4

    phishfood

    phishfood

    phishfood

    Moderator Staff Member Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2010
    Messages:
    5,775
    Likes Received:
    992
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    IPC code, that is legal. Real life code, it works well.
     
  5. Jan 17, 2015 #5

    JackJ

    JackJ

    JackJ

    Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2015
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    ,
    There is no basin it's located elsewhere and absolutely positively cannot be tied into this setup.

    I live in iowa under IPC adopted code.

    Frodo why isn't it legal? If the fixture at the end was a lavatory instead of a shower it would be legal right? So why not a shower?
     
  6. Jan 17, 2015 #6

    Nukedaddy

    Nukedaddy

    Nukedaddy

    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2013
    Messages:
    20
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    St. Louis, IL
    Illinois code is somewhat based on UPC and I think this would pass inspection if the drain and vent are both 2" and the developed length from toilet to vent is less than 4 feet. And, the vent is connected to the shower drain at a 45 degee roll or more upwards to help keep it "dry".
     
  7. Jan 18, 2015 #7

    frodo

    frodo

    frodo

    Just call me Macgyver Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,400
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    Location:
    ,
    a water closet is 3 fixture units [residential tank type] the drawing shows the w/c wet venting the drain for the shower
    that would make the minimum size of the vertical pipe to be required to be 1 pipe size larger than the upper drain.
    in this case 4'' it does not meet the exception, 3''
    also, the toilet itself is not vented in that picture.
    the vent must be above the flow line of the w/c.

    to make that drawing work with a 3'' pipe..move the terlet to below the shower drain, vent it

    Untitledjhgjhg.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2015
    JoeThePlumber and DavidT like this.
  8. Jan 18, 2015 #8

    shaken-n-stirred

    shaken-n-stirred

    shaken-n-stirred

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2015
    Messages:
    95
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    ,
    I thought that the "one size larger" issue had to do with the up stream or vented system. In the case of a lav used as a vent for a toilet the ordinarily 1 1/2 inch lav drain has to be upped to a 2" drain and vent to in essence accomadate both water from the lav and still accomadate air for the toilet at the same time. The toilet drain does not need to be upsized.

    Correct me where I am wrong.

    As for the current question, I think codes do not allow tubs to wet vent a WC the same way as a lav is allowed. Why, I have no idea. It seems to me to be the same physical thing.
     
  9. Jan 19, 2015 #9

    frodo

    frodo

    frodo

    Just call me Macgyver Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,400
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    Location:
    ,
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2015
    JoeThePlumber likes this.
  10. Jan 19, 2015 #10

    shaken-n-stirred

    shaken-n-stirred

    shaken-n-stirred

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2015
    Messages:
    95
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    ,
    Hey Frodo, I do not know your experience, expertise, and history here on this board and I know I am not by any means a trained plumber, however, I believe the issue at hand is an issue of horizontal wet venting and you have cited vertical wet vents. If that is not the case please explain why?

    I believe the wet vent is the drain section between the dry vent for the tub and on down to the toilet discharge. If that is the case the wet vent is sized per the upstream fixture (ie tub) and upsized by one diameter.

    NO?
     
  11. Jan 20, 2015 #11

    frodo

    frodo

    frodo

    Just call me Macgyver Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,400
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    Location:
    ,
    yeah man! you got me on that. your drawing is legal. would I do it that way?

    NO,

    I prefer not to install using the minimum standards.

    it gets you by, its legal, it is what it is, minimum standard


    I would do it this way. th0XHKHXWP.jpg







    .
     
  12. Jan 20, 2015 #12

    shaken-n-stirred

    shaken-n-stirred

    shaken-n-stirred

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2015
    Messages:
    95
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    ,
    Hey Frodo,

    I am not saying the original drawing is legal or is not legal. I really do not know. I would think it would be fine, but maybe not legal. As for your suggestion of adding a separate vent for the WC, probably is the best. But do you have too? I am not sure.

    When I have TRIED to read the code on wet venting it APPEARS to me to be saying you can use a lav for a wet vent but can not use a tub or shower or washing machine or anything else. Could some one tell me if I am reading that correctly? If I am reading it correctly then the original picture is not legal.

    As for your post, I was just saying that your arrow was not pointing at a vent of any kind, just the WC drain and it appeared you were looking at the wrong section of code.

    I am by no means a practicing plumber so an very very reluctant to tell anyone on this board anything.

    I post to learn and to clarify.

    Thanks everyone.
     
  13. Jan 20, 2015 #13

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Easily Amused Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2010
    Messages:
    4,171
    Likes Received:
    1,058
    Location:
    Santee,Ca,
    Would the vertical drain from the sink be considered the wet vent for the tub drain? Sink being 1-1/4" or 1-1/2". vertical drain 2".

    To eliminate wet vent just run another vent for the tub trap arm.

    Would it be better to connect the horizontal drain from tub and sink to stack with a wye or combo?

    th0XHKHXWP.jpg
     
  14. Jan 21, 2015 #14

    frodo

    frodo

    frodo

    Just call me Macgyver Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,400
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    Location:
    ,
    the code, as i understand it, says
    wet venting is limited to vertical drainage piping receiving the discharge from the trap arm of 0ne [1] and two [2] fixture unit fixture that alsp serves as a vent for not to exceed four [4] fixtures.

    a lav f/u is 1 and a tub/shower is 2

    washing machine is 3

    the reason a tub cant be wet vented is .."wet vent shall

    be within the same story as the wet vented fixture" see drawing

    does anyone agree?

    th0XHKHXWP.jpg
     
  15. Jan 21, 2015 #15

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Easily Amused Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2010
    Messages:
    4,171
    Likes Received:
    1,058
    Location:
    Santee,Ca,
    I would agree. Frodo may have to rethink his reply. The 4" he is referring to is not a wet vent due to the vent already on the trap arm.
    If you eliminate the original vent ( where the sink was scrubbed out of the picture ) and move it to the stack , then the section between the Closet bend and the tub drain would be a wet vent for the tub.

    zz.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2015
  16. Jan 21, 2015 #16

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Easily Amused Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2010
    Messages:
    4,171
    Likes Received:
    1,058
    Location:
    Santee,Ca,
    Is not the Tub (fixture) located on the same story/floor as the wet vent even though the tub drain is below the floor?

    add a vent for the tub , problem solved.

    th0XHKHXWP.jpg
     
  17. Jan 21, 2015 #17

    frodo

    frodo

    frodo

    Just call me Macgyver Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,400
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    Location:
    ,

    True, i am having a problem with the take off for the vent being under the
    the horiziontal trap arm.

    granted, 905.5 states. except for w/c and simular fixtures, shall not be below the trap weir.

    i do not think that applies here. the way that vent is configured.

    from the 90 to the tee has no vent. just as a combo installed on the vertical has the vent cut off.

    correct me if i'm wrong, but thats what i see

    th0XHKHXWP.jpg
     
  18. Jan 21, 2015 #18

    frodo

    frodo

    frodo

    Just call me Macgyver Professional Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2014
    Messages:
    7,400
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    Location:
    ,


    see what i am talking about? section of vent below floor.

    to picky?

    th0XHKHXWP.jpg
     
  19. Jan 21, 2015 #19

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Easily Amused Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2010
    Messages:
    4,171
    Likes Received:
    1,058
    Location:
    Santee,Ca,
    Probably Not.
     
  20. Jan 21, 2015 #20

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Mr_David

    Easily Amused Professional

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2010
    Messages:
    4,171
    Likes Received:
    1,058
    Location:
    Santee,Ca,
    Don't think you can classify increasing the vertical section to 4" as a wet went without a dry vent coming in from the top.
     

Share This Page