winterizing using a remote water shut off and drain valve in crawl space

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joe core4

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blowing rock nc
Hi All,
Want to be able to shut off main water line in crawl space off via a switch inside and also want to install another valve right above to drain the lines for winter protection while gone and possibly another valve to pump in rv antifreeze into system, 3 story house with 4 bathrooms. Have been doing this manually in a walk in basement on another house for years but it's a difficult crawl at this house and I'm getting too old to do so!
So thoughts? Thinking will add 3 110v SPST switches located in house, but can use relays to motorized valves if necessary.
My ideal scenario;
Flip 1st switch 1st valve shuts off main water supply in crawlspace via motorized valve.
Flip 2nd switch & 2nd motorized valve just above it opens to drain out lines in house, then flip it back to close.
Flip 3rd switch & 3rd motorized valve above 2nd opens to pump in rv antifreeze then flip back to close when filled. I'll run a line from portable antifreeze pump inside house to a T there.
Trying to do as cost effective as possible and prefer to stay away from wifi type dependent valves. I see lots of NO or NC 3/4'' motorized valves but they require continuous power to stay open or closed so not a option. unless using a step down transformer. So is this where relays and transformers come into play? I'm a plumber and electrician so prefer to stay with what I am familiar with being no transformers or relays if possible. Someone recommended to possibly use irrigation valves? Been searching for hours and can't find much. Thanks in advance for advice.
 
They do make them. I have installed at one house. It was a strap on devise for quarter turn valve. I never got to go back and check it. They energized it.
But this is the closest I can find. Look expensive if you ask me.
Also be careful of injecting antifreeze in water lines. Here we only put the antifreeze in the sewage side. For toilets and traps. Open and drain water lines then blow out with air at each individual location. But you’ve done it for years and you lost me at servo switches. Lol


Wireless Z-Wave Water Valve 3/4" inch; Cert ID: ZC08-13040028 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B006KU10ZI/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
 
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Those motorized valves are too darn expensive.
Likely due to that newer Wireless Z-Wave technology.
There are motorized full port ball valves around for well under $100. Both AC and DC.
Yeah air would be a nice way to go if you have enough air volume to insure you get all the remaining water out. But I think using a safe antifreeze, as proposed, is a good approach.
I assume one must go around to all he fixtures to allow the antifreeze to flow to them.
How do you handle the water heater storage tank?

A 3-way motorized ball valve crossed my mind, however, not sure they are available with full ports. It could be set up with a 3-way switch. Fill/Off/Drain.

EDIT: On second thought, not sure if 3-way ball valve is capable of closing off both the service and the drain, as would be required when the antifreeze must be filled. A 4-way would work but too involved now. The simpler the better.
 
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yeah It’s all expensive. I in middle Tennessee so our winterizing is “soft”. We might get a week of freezing. So I am not experienced enough with that. Had great luck without anti freeze in the fresh water pipe. Take a drink first to see if you should worry.
 
Water heater I usually drain and leave valves open. I was thinking that question was for op but I answering just in case. I like your 3 way valve design. Genius. Upgrade to connect to smart phone.
 
Water heater I usually drain and leave valves open. I was thinking that question was for op but I answering just in case. I like your 3 way valve design. Genius. Upgrade to connect to smart phone.
Yeah...I was actually curious as to how the OP handled the water tank, assuming he has one. I was thinking he drains it and isolates it prior to filling the rest of the system with antifreeze. But even then, you must end up with dead legs of water unless he had a bypass around it. Although I suspect the antifreeze would slowly mix in with any remaining water.

I've been retired for years but enjoy keeping my mind thinking about improving things.
I had the idea of dual flush modes for toilets(for no. 1 or no. 2), long before I ever heard of it actually being done. LOL
 
we Could eat this thread up bouncing ideas. Maybe this guy will find something. I know for the right person there is a way to do all he wants. But I would almost write a letter to watts and see if they can’t come up with something. I could find a commercial valve for utility district. You know they going to all electrical water meters that they control from their office. So the tech is out there. Just not sure if demand has it in a variety yet.
What about a single main valve , with a vacuum breaker up higher than highest faucet and a vacuum breaker at lowest at a point lower than the water lines. But installed on house side of main. When you shut off main and go turn on a faucet. Then the reactions start. The top vacuum opens up to start drawing top down. Once that all emptied. The bottom vacuum breaker will open up and start drawing from that open faucet down. Also need a breaker on hot line to drain the hot line. Everyone forget to drain the hot line. But that’s a huge dead leg there. I dunno do you follow. Think that would work for him ?
 
Hi All,
Want to be able to shut off main water line in crawl space off via a switch inside and also want to install another valve right above to drain the lines for winter protection while gone and possibly another valve to pump in rv antifreeze into system, 3 story house with 4 bathrooms. Have been doing this manually in a walk in basement on another house for years but it's a difficult crawl at this house and I'm getting too old to do so!
So thoughts? Thinking will add 3 110v SPST switches located in house, but can use relays to motorized valves if necessary.
My ideal scenario;
Flip 1st switch 1st valve shuts off main water supply in crawlspace via motorized valve.
Flip 2nd switch & 2nd motorized valve just above it opens to drain out lines in house, then flip it back to close.
Flip 3rd switch & 3rd motorized valve above 2nd opens to pump in rv antifreeze then flip back to close when filled. I'll run a line from portable antifreeze pump inside house to a T there.
Trying to do as cost effective as possible and prefer to stay away from wifi type dependent valves. I see lots of NO or NC 3/4'' motorized valves but they require continuous power to stay open or closed so not a option. unless using a step down transformer. So is this where relays and transformers come into play? I'm a plumber and electrician so prefer to stay with what I am familiar with being no transformers or relays if possible. Someone recommended to possibly use irrigation valves? Been searching for hours and can't find much. Thanks in advance for advice.
Well I actually like the relatively straight forward approach that joe core4 plans to do.
A switch for each 110v motorized valve. Except not sure about the SPST. I would think SPDT switches would be required for OPEN/OFF/CLOSE.
And why relays if 110v valves are used?
Looking more closely for these valves they do appear to be more popular as DC powered. And even some of the motorized valves are energized open and de-energized to close valve(valves closes with power from internal capacitor). I believe it was preferred not to have these valves failed to a specific position upon loss of power, as a typical solenoid valve would. But thinking about this, why not have the valves fail to their NORMAL positions. Water supply fails open; drain valve fails closed; Anifreeze line fails closed.
They do have soft closing solenoid valves if that is a concern.
 

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