I want to attempt something to get rid of scale in my hot water line
in my house. I need your advise to make sure I'm not going to damage
the existing plumbing. First let me explain the problem, then I'll
explain what I'd like to do. I'm out of ideas and really need help as
this is driving me nuts! Sorry for the long post but I need to give
you the background.
BACKGROUND
My double story house built in 1995 and there were 2 x 50G gas hot
water heaters upstairs in the attic above the master bedroom.
When I purchase the house in 2010 the owner replaced the original hot
water tanks with a fancy 50G A.O.Smith Vertex high efficiency gas
water heater. That single tank provided enough hot water for the
whole house!
After being in the house about a year (so maybe tank was 1.5 years
old) I started noticing particles coming through the hot water line in
the kitchen. I'm 99% sure the particles are calcium build-up (scale) as
vinegar seems to soften them. Also the dip tube on the A.O.Smith tank
was blue PVC, not white. I used to flush the tank frequently which
helped but didn't solve the issue. I got so fed up with particles
blocking faucet screens that I replaced the high efficiency tank with
two 50G Rheem conventional water heaters two years ago. I'm sure the
super fast heating was producing precipitates. Tank was 80K BTU insead
of the typical 36-40K.
I had the plumber connect one of the new tanks to the master and guest
bath, and the other tank to the bathroom upstairs and then, downstairs
to the utility room and kitchen.
After installing the new tanks I still noticed the particles in the
kitchen sink faucet. I waited figuring this would clear itself out of
the pipe. It didn't. So this lead me to think the scale is in the hot
water pipes themselves since the tanks were new. So I tried one last
thing. I installed a 3M Aqua-Pure Scale Inhibitor (AP430ss) which a
buddy of mine told me about. The unit fits on cold water inlet going
into the hot water tank that feeds the kitchen. The fitting takes a
replaceable cartridge with "food-grade" acid and is supposed to
disolve the buildup in the pipes. It's been on for 2 years now but I
still get particles blocking the sink faucet.
In the past winter, water flowing out of the sink faucet has got so
slow that I've had to remove the faucet head and wash it out 3 times
while washing dishes. It's always worse first thing in the morning,
which has to be due the scale in the cold pipes expanding as the hot
water flows over it.
This summer I hardly notice any scale. I was thinking the 3M scale
inhibitor was finally working, but as it has started to cool down at
night, the scale has started reappearing.
I have one idea short of ripping open walls and replacing the hot
water line to the utility room and kitchen,
MY LAST IDEA (and I need your advice here)
I had an idea of creating a recirculating loop in the hot water line
and running vinegar through it. I'm sure this will help.
To do this I'd connect a short hose from the washer hot water outlet
in the utility room and run that into bucket. The bucked would have a
submersible pump with a 100' garden hose attached. The hose would run
to the hot water sink value in the upstairs bathroom. This would
create a recirculating the loop and I'd simply pour vinegar into the
bucket and let the pump run for a while.
What I need to know is what size pump I should use. I don't want to
connect something and damage the plumbing. I think there's a 12'
difference in height between the washer downstairs and since faucet
value upstairs.
Also, would it be better to have the pump downstairs and "push"
vinegar upstairs to the 3/8" sink facucet value fitting, or, have the
pump upstairs feeding directly into the faucet value and "push" the
vinegar from upstairs, through the copper line downstairs, then
through the hose upstairs?
Couple of things I should mention:
0) my neighbours don't have hot water issues
1) the sink fixtures attached to the other new tank don't have any scale
issues
2) I've turn down the water temp which should limit new scale buildup
3) there is PEX pipe running from the new hot water tank across from one
side the house to the other, and then connects to the original copper
pipes that feeds the upstairs bathroom and the goes down to the utility
room and kitchen. Can the PEX to copper connections be causing
scale? The PEX was apparently added when the Vertex heater was
installed.
in my house. I need your advise to make sure I'm not going to damage
the existing plumbing. First let me explain the problem, then I'll
explain what I'd like to do. I'm out of ideas and really need help as
this is driving me nuts! Sorry for the long post but I need to give
you the background.
BACKGROUND
My double story house built in 1995 and there were 2 x 50G gas hot
water heaters upstairs in the attic above the master bedroom.
When I purchase the house in 2010 the owner replaced the original hot
water tanks with a fancy 50G A.O.Smith Vertex high efficiency gas
water heater. That single tank provided enough hot water for the
whole house!
After being in the house about a year (so maybe tank was 1.5 years
old) I started noticing particles coming through the hot water line in
the kitchen. I'm 99% sure the particles are calcium build-up (scale) as
vinegar seems to soften them. Also the dip tube on the A.O.Smith tank
was blue PVC, not white. I used to flush the tank frequently which
helped but didn't solve the issue. I got so fed up with particles
blocking faucet screens that I replaced the high efficiency tank with
two 50G Rheem conventional water heaters two years ago. I'm sure the
super fast heating was producing precipitates. Tank was 80K BTU insead
of the typical 36-40K.
I had the plumber connect one of the new tanks to the master and guest
bath, and the other tank to the bathroom upstairs and then, downstairs
to the utility room and kitchen.
After installing the new tanks I still noticed the particles in the
kitchen sink faucet. I waited figuring this would clear itself out of
the pipe. It didn't. So this lead me to think the scale is in the hot
water pipes themselves since the tanks were new. So I tried one last
thing. I installed a 3M Aqua-Pure Scale Inhibitor (AP430ss) which a
buddy of mine told me about. The unit fits on cold water inlet going
into the hot water tank that feeds the kitchen. The fitting takes a
replaceable cartridge with "food-grade" acid and is supposed to
disolve the buildup in the pipes. It's been on for 2 years now but I
still get particles blocking the sink faucet.
In the past winter, water flowing out of the sink faucet has got so
slow that I've had to remove the faucet head and wash it out 3 times
while washing dishes. It's always worse first thing in the morning,
which has to be due the scale in the cold pipes expanding as the hot
water flows over it.
This summer I hardly notice any scale. I was thinking the 3M scale
inhibitor was finally working, but as it has started to cool down at
night, the scale has started reappearing.
I have one idea short of ripping open walls and replacing the hot
water line to the utility room and kitchen,
MY LAST IDEA (and I need your advice here)
I had an idea of creating a recirculating loop in the hot water line
and running vinegar through it. I'm sure this will help.
To do this I'd connect a short hose from the washer hot water outlet
in the utility room and run that into bucket. The bucked would have a
submersible pump with a 100' garden hose attached. The hose would run
to the hot water sink value in the upstairs bathroom. This would
create a recirculating the loop and I'd simply pour vinegar into the
bucket and let the pump run for a while.
What I need to know is what size pump I should use. I don't want to
connect something and damage the plumbing. I think there's a 12'
difference in height between the washer downstairs and since faucet
value upstairs.
Also, would it be better to have the pump downstairs and "push"
vinegar upstairs to the 3/8" sink facucet value fitting, or, have the
pump upstairs feeding directly into the faucet value and "push" the
vinegar from upstairs, through the copper line downstairs, then
through the hose upstairs?
Couple of things I should mention:
0) my neighbours don't have hot water issues
1) the sink fixtures attached to the other new tank don't have any scale
issues
2) I've turn down the water temp which should limit new scale buildup
3) there is PEX pipe running from the new hot water tank across from one
side the house to the other, and then connects to the original copper
pipes that feeds the upstairs bathroom and the goes down to the utility
room and kitchen. Can the PEX to copper connections be causing
scale? The PEX was apparently added when the Vertex heater was
installed.