1979 gate valve

This one has been bugging me for awhile and any advice accepted. Years ago in San Diego I had a gate valve fail when the gate broke off the shaft internally due to electrolysis. I'd like to avoid the same scenario at my current home in NorCal. The main supply comes up out of the ground and is attached to the gate valve that I wish to replace with a ball valve if code will allow that. The house was built in 1979. The inlet line out of the ground appears visually to be some kind of black plastic and is around an inch and 1/8. It dos not look like ABS or anything like that - looks more flexible. I don't have the exact measurements or a photo with me although I will try to post some. Does anyone know what kind of plastic inlet lines were used in 1979, and what risk there is trying to unscrew, unclamp (or whatever the mechanism is of holding the valve to the line) that gate valve from the inlet line? Above the gate it is soldered copper but I don't know what that line is coming out of the ground. Any ideas? I'd hate to try to grab it with a pipe wrench and have it shatter at the ground after 35 years of weathering. Tract built home 1979, copper in the rest of the house thru the attic. Originally had Payne Heater and air, AO Smith water heater, cottage cheese ceiling, harvest gold countertops, T-111 siding, comp roof - pretty standard house for the era. - in Sacramento County and was built to 1979 codes.

looking at photos online and a news article from 1979 I suspect it is a polybutylene supply line that then goes to copper thru the house. I don't think there is enough room to put a second supply shutoff above the original gate but if there is that would be the solution I think. Then I can just leave the original gate in the open position and not worry about it when I have to turn water on and off. I am just fearing that one day I will turn the water off and the handle will just spin and spin trying to open it afterwards like what happened in San Diego. That valve was 15 years old when it happened. This one is 37 years old.

Many times you can just unscrew the guts of the old gate valve and replace with new internals. If you can shut it off at the meter, then why not try?

havasu said:

Many times you can just unscrew the guts of the old gate valve and replace with new internals. If you can shut it off at the meter, then why not try?

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I'll give it a try. Did not realize that part of a gate valve was reasonably standardized. We've lost most of the plumbing warehouses here in the Sacramento area who had a history of carrying real plumbing fixtures and parts. Sure is different than my childhood in the 1960's when one could walk into a warehouse and say, "Have anything like this?" Two minutes later an identical one was on the counter. That or you called the company and a pleasant service rep said, "yes, we get calls for that and have boxes of those, send me your address and we'll just send you the piece that needs to be replaced. It'll come with a new gasket too..."

Thank you for the suggestion.

In my area of So Cal, I've found our local Ace Hardware carries a far better selection of parts than the usual big box stores. You may pay a few bucks more, and will need to toss the outer housing, but it sure would give you some comfort knowing you have a valve that works.

Thank You - much appreciated

update and a couple questions. The old gate does screw onto pipe. Above that it is soldered. The pipe appears to be a plastic 1 1/4" pipe similar to the dark gray plastic ones that one can buy at HD or Lowe'. It has been there since 1979. I took photos of the gate to the only local plumbing supply in the Sacramento area that sells a plethora of older parts. Everyone else sells parts made of chineseium. They said that they would replace the gate because out of the several hundred times people have tried to replace just the gate portion it has only worked out twice that they know of, and that they don't have one identical to that. So here are the two questions that will help me determine if this one is over my head.

1) The gate valve has been on this plastic pipe for 40 years this year. I don't imagine it will easily release. If I use a pipe wrench on that plastic riser, what are the odds it will shatter? I also have a strap wrench for oil filters that I use sometimes on large plastic parts that unscrew. Is there a special tool for the large plastic pipes like this? I do not want to break it because if I do there will be some serious digging involved.

2) If I remove it, can I use pipe dope on the threads installing the new ball valve? I usually use some teflon sealant that is in a bottle I got at NAPA. It works on about everything. Normally the rule when tightening is hand tight plus 1 to 1 1/2 turns more. What would the rule be on a large 1 1/4" plastic pipe like this that is 40 years old?

apparently no one has encountered this, or this is a pretty dead forum. I will try the strap wrench or hire a plumber that the supply house recommended.

the end of you last post is what you should do if its material your unfamiliar with and not comfortable working with you will avoid a possible disaster I haven't worked with poly pipe as a water main only lawn sprinkler the pipe is heated up the fitting is pushed in then its crimped together with a stainless ring a lead free ball valve is what would be used and threaded onto the copper then you would rejoin the poly from there I would recommend a lic/insured professional

Geofd said:

the end of you last post is what you should do if its material your unfamiliar with and not comfortable working with you will avoid a possible disaster I haven't worked with poly pipe as a water main only lawn sprinkler the pipe is heated up the fitting is pushed in then its crimped together with a stainless ring a lead free ball valve is what would be used and threaded onto the copper then you would rejoin the poly from there I would recommend a lic/insured professional

Click to expand...

Thanks Geofd. As I said in the next to last post, this appears to be plastic pipe with threads, similar to galvanized but 1 1/4 plastic. That said I probably will have a plumber who has experience in the area tackle it. I just lack the feel on a pipe that size and would not know when to stop if something was going wrong. Technically it is a no-brainer. Tactilely it could be a small disaster.

Pictures would help us help you.

brass gate valve 1 1/2" screws onto 1 1/2" plastic pipe. Gate valve necks down to 1 1/4" outlet. Sun hits this area every day for the last 40 years. I'll probably let someone who has done this before and has a feel for whether the pipe will collapse or not. Pretty sure the riser is plastic. I haven't scraped it but it is clearly gray in color, not weathered brass, copper or galvanized.

I will call the plumber in a couple days since I lack the feel on this size, and type threaded plastic pipe.